Godot

Encouraged by MPFC, here's a thread to keep an eye on all those people who got away from disasters, crashes, sinkings, bunkers, prison camps and generally newsworthy happenings who may be remembered simply because they were there or in this case related to someone who was. I've been wondering about all the Hitlers out there. Of course there may be the odd imposter.

Excellent interview with Andy Ripley in the Telegraph today. It says he has prostate cancer. He doesn't look anywhere near death's door to me although he has had a pulmonary embolism brought on, possibly, by his fanatical exercise regime on the rowing machines. I know there are threads for football, cricket and baseball but there's nothing that I know of on here to discuss a real game, rugby union, where some big names, people like Fred Allen (former NZ rugby coach, born 1920) are getting on a bit. Others a bit younger, like Willie John McBride, have been ravaged by the after-dinner circuit so are not likely to last too long. Then there are cannibal rugby players well worth tracking. Can't survive for ever.

I've been looking for a thread on artists and can't find one. Apart from discussing soon to be dead artists such as Lucian Freud, I'd like to kick this off with a debate on the dear departed Beryl Cook. Who is the better artist, Beryl Cook or Tracey Emin? And is Rolf Harris better than both of them? One of Beryl's buxom ladies.

Poetry, poets, dead ones, dying ones, deathly ones. Spy corner has demonstrated that there is more than a passing interest among deathlisters in poetry and poets as TF suggested some time ago. Stanley Kunitz is one among many. Who will be next? Louis Simpson? Gunter Grass, the SS poet? Lawrence Ferlinghetti? A thread for favourite poems, discourse on all things poetic and, of course, poets who are potential deathlist material. Ernesto Cardenal, Henri Chopin, Robert Creeley, Hans Enzensberger, Tuli Kupferberg, Noel Edmonds: names you are not likely to find in the Big Brother House. Dedicated to Emily Dickinson, the matriarch of deathly verse.

Switched the telly on last night and caught the end of an item on Donald McGill, one of the UK's best know postcard artists yet ignored when he died, not even a gravestone. There are some great cartoonists out there and some are getting on a bit. Of all places this should be one where their health and well being is monitored ahead of their last laugh. Bill Tidy has been working 46 years so is not so young. Mac seems to have been going for ever. I see Maurice Dodd (the Perishers) died on New Year's Eve, don't remember anyone mentioning him so he was one that got away. There's a big list here: http://www.cagle.com/prolinks/library/syndARTISTS.asp There is even a site devoted to the graves of dead cartoonists: http://www.planetcartoonist.com/graves.shtml

This is really DDT's thread as it was his idea and he's the real Archers' fan on the DL, but it seems fitting on the occasion of its 60th anniversary to begin discussing candidates from the series, some of whom are growing quite long in the tooth. Yes, it may well drop like a stone, but there are a lot more rubbish threads than this and Norman Painting deserves a better resting place. Besides, it may encourage some of our North American members to get up to scratch on what's going on. Also here. I'm wondering if Nigel Pargetter might have survived.

I've started this thread (and please merge if there is already one like it) because I know that fellow Deathlisters are well equipped to answer all kinds of off beat questions. So here's one: I was reading the Metro on the train the other day and found an item about an NHS opinion poll over plans to create lifelike anatomical images online to illustrate medical conditions. There were two options - one with reproductive organs illustrated and one with doll-like images that showed nothing at all where our organs should be. I have been looking for some on-line reference but can't find one and haven't turned-up the story in any other newspaper. Has anyone else seen this? If so, could you point to an on-line source. I'm never sure about whether to treat a Metro story as a reliable source.

Mollie Sugden among the cast of Are You being Served which has a few survivors who are all getting long in the tooth. Also other fading sitcom stars like Richard Bryers, Warren Mitchell, Mike Winters. Sugden will go before Clive Dunn but Eric Sykes might go before both of them. What happened to Polly James off the Liver Birds? Can't find any recent biog. How is Bill Pertwee these days? Also it's worth a trawl among the Grand Order of Water Rats, the society of comedy hasbeens offering summat to do as they wait for death

I know I'm not the only one to find things I think that the world would be better off without. Lifejackets on planes, for example. Has anybody in the history of commercial airlines ever used one? Not in the past 10 years I'll bet. It's not just the jackets it's all those instructions about how to put them on: what for? If that plane goes down everyone on board is instant mash. It's a nonsense ritual that has lost all meaning in modern air travel. Come on deathlisters, I know there are things you would really like to see disappear. What's your waste of space?

Have been doing some research tonight, including a trawl through previous threads and can't find anything on spies. Some more research is needed on people like George Blake, Michael Bettaney and Lord Cuckney who are all getting on. Cuckney would prefer people didn't know it but he was in British intelligence according to Peter Wright in Spycatcher. Wickipedia has bugger all on Bettaney and Blake but both must be good ages by now. Must be some good old American spies out there? Does anyone know anything about spies beyond The Man From UNCLE?

I suspect that most Deathlisters are not natural shoppers. I try to stay away from shops, but today I went to an auction out of curiosity (mrs Godot is away). I hadn't meant to buy anything but came back with 15 fishing rods, a very large box of feathers, a stuffed pike and a chamber pot, having no real idea how I came to have them. But the bidding felt good, addictive even. Do you remember that Laurel and Hardy film where the tough guy wraps their legs around their necks at the end? Well Mrs Godot is going to do that to me when she sees what I've done to our savings. I just wondered, for the sake of comfort, if fellow Deathlisters have bought anything strange or anything they might have regretted? Does anyone collect anything weird? It looks now like I collect fishing rods.

Assassinations are notoriously difficult to predict but I would guess they account for at least one famous person a year. This year we had Rafiq Hariri in Lebanon. Who might be considered assassination risks for 2006? The hit on Lennon came out of the blue. What about Sven-Goran Eriksson pre world cup? It could happen. The Americans might get Bin Laden at last (but I doubt it). Ariel Sharon has to be in the frame, one would have thought, having a name like an Essex girl. It's possible that someone might get at Saddam before justice prevails. I should make it clear I don't want to see anyone bumped off but to be forewarned is to be forearmed.

Since the founder of WikiLeaks is not going to go away unless his disappearance is arranged as some have suggested, the saga of WikiLeaks is going to run and run. So perhaps we should record its progress here. Is he good DeathList material or is he too well known to "fall" under a No. 7 bus? It's not as if he hasn't made any enemies. Some are smelling blood already. From Wikipedia:

At risk of appearing flippant I wanted to discuss this in all seriousness. Is a First World War veteran or Titanic Survivor more worthy of deathlist inclusion than a Munchkin? I would argue that each Munchkin originally had a greater claim to fame than most WWI survivors and most Titanic survivors. With only seven survivors (out of 124) left, with the passing of time the remaining Munchkins will grow more famous because of their rarity. So at what stage might a Munchkin make the deathlist? With referance to TF's comment about Ross Davidson I notice there is no shortage of DDP entries that have included him. But TF (see lock 2006 possibilities) has a point. I just think it worth debating. Is Margaret Pellegrini, for example, a worthy candidate? Do little people last as long as bigger people? http://jscms.jrn.columbia.edu/cns/2005-03-...os-munchkinland

I'm wondering if there is an appetite for discussion about all the gagging orders going around recently and, if not the gagging itself, those the courts are seeking to protect. I raised the issue in the football thread but, as Andrew Marr disclosed today, we're not just talking about footballers but all kinds of prominent people. It's hardly death related, unless exposure were to drive one to suicide, but at the very least it may help to satiate Deathlisters' curiosity. Can anyone else name names, or at least links to names? It would be a nice way to tell Mr Justice Eady where to stick his contra mundum orders.

It seems to me that bricks, even briquettes, are so ubiquitous in modern life, inspiring art, cinema, music, cuisine and government policy, that some discussion of their relevance, history and contemporary influence deserves a thread of its own. Some may disagree.

For a while now I have been worrying about Belgians. Has a Belgian ever made it on to the deathlist? If not why not? I have decided to dedicate the rest of my life to scouring Belgium for people famous enough and, more importantly, decrepit enough to make the deathlist. Can anyone help, please? Who knows, there may even be a dedicated Belgian deathlist but I don't know of it. There is a list of famous Belgians out there to kick off with. Sadly many are dead and at least one is fictional, but that's Belgium for you. http://www.famousbelgians.net/ This isn't one of those light, flipant threads. It needs work so that means it will probably be short and possibly short lived. But I think the Belgians are worth it. Belgium gave us Rene Magritte (the artist who painted the man with his nose in his pipe), George Simenon, author and serial bed post notcher, and the Singing Nun. Without Belgium there would be no Tin Tin or Snowy, remember that. List of pretty interesting things that happened in Belgium: The Battle of Waterloo German invasions (2) The Common Agricultural Policy (launch of) The Battle of Ypres Jeux sans Frontiers (Belgian round)

Yup, to discuss Jenni Murray and her problems. But also I thought it might be a celebration of Woman's Hour over the millennia, as an alternative "women friendly" thread for discussion of sensitive topics such as hot flushes, PMT (pathetic men's tension), equality issues, all the "ings" (cleaning, dusting, vacuuming, ironing, washing, baking, sowing, knitting, breeding, screening), hot topics in People's Friend, daytime TV, Trisha and all the latest gossip in OK magazine plus more "right on" up to date Jenni Murray stuff such as how to deal with premature ejaculation. Just to kick things off: do you prefer the Dyson upright to the pull along? Personally I like the way the pull-along can get at the stairs. Come on chaps and chapesses, get together with your inner selves. Here's the last list you're going to see on this thread: Coming up: marmalade - does and don'ts How to get closer to your cat Where to find knickers that fit Giving birth - is it worth it? Tattooing - how discreet should it be? How to end the affair Is Patrick Moore gay?

This chick deserves a thread of her own. Tantrums, bizzare behaviour, emotional breakdown, booking in to the Priory clinic, advice from Max Clifford. Scotland's own Amy Winehouse could self distruct faster than it took her to come second on Britain's Got Talent.

By unpopular demand this thread is to discuss topiary and topiarists, including those interested in topiary such as Monty Don, not to mention international topiarist and Belgian (famous Belgian?), Jacques Wirtz. Arguably It could be extended to other gardeners but that might make it even less popular for those concerned about meronomy. Personally it doesn't worry me.

Sorry, bad timing, not many DLers about and needs research but I'm excited about the von Trapps. Apparently they now live quietly in Vermont but there must be tons of them, probably more than surviving munchkins. Maria must be long dead, but what about the kids? Famous enough, surely. All that stuff in the film - it didn't happen. They caught a bloody train and didn't live happily ever. I quote: "The isolation of a life on the road or on the farm, combined with constant work and Maria's volatile temper, took its toll. Rosmarie, Maria's eldest child, suffered a nervous breakdown and her mother sent her for electro-shock therapy. Another daughter ran away to elope." It's like Eastenders.

If there's one thing that keeps me awake at nights it's the prospect that this woman or one of her admirers might be a future US president. Since the "who will be the next US president?" thread is closed I thought some discussion might be appropriate here. The tea party isn't going to go away in a hurry so this is the place for dunking tea bags.

I note that Stephen Griffiths' pseudonym Ven Pariah already brings up 30,100 references when searched in Google. I wonder what the number will be a year from now? If moderators believe he isn't worthy of his own thread please add this to a general serial killers thread if there is one. I thought there was but couldn't find it. Anyhow I'm sure this nutter is going to be collecting quite a few more column inches in the years ahead so perhaps he deserves one on his own. I worked on some of the Sutcliffe killings many years ago. For some reason police then were reluctant to link some of the attacks and it seems things haven't changed. I wonder how many more there would have been in this case had the murder not been videoed. Are video taped murders rare?

Notapotato's mention of gravy reminded me that it's that time of year again. Pancakes on Tuesday - I love pancakes - then 40 days of going without something from Ash Wednesday. You don't have to be religious to do this. I find it helps to concentrate the mind for a while. Last year I gave up gravy and it was tough I can tell you. This year I was thinking of giving up oranges but I have decided to do without potatoes and bread. So no chip butties until Easter Sunday. Since a jacket potato topped with butter, grated cheese and tuna with mayonnaise is possibly my favourite meal, this is going to be some ordeal. It makes gravy pale by comparison. Come on there must be something you can give up for Lent. MPFC could give up Carlisle Utd, that's easy enough. Walter could give up complaining and Matilda, well she could simply give up. List your sacrifices here, then stick to it.

Talk about squid all day long.