7 - Intelligence

[Banshees Scream 107]

It is said that there are seven different kinds of intellegence. I believe the first option doesn't even qualify.

 

Potential isolation by brain damage.

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals.

An identifiable core operation or set of operations.

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances.

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility.

Support from experimental psychological tasks.

Support from psychometric findings.

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system.

 

At the moment i'm trying to find which intellegence is of my own. Which belongs to you?

[VSBfromH 74]

I believe I belong to an 8th kind, commonly known as "WTF? Can you explain this to me with pretty pictures?"

[The Pooka 25]

It is said that there are seven different kinds of intellegence. I believe the first option doesn't even qualify.

 

Potential isolation by brain damage.

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals.

An identifiable core operation or set of operations.

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances.

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility.

Support from experimental psychological tasks.

Support from psychometric findings.

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system.

 

At the moment i'm trying to find which intellegence is of my own. Which belongs to you?

 

BS, I'm not sure I understand this and, I suppose, that may place me in options 1 or 2. None of the 8 (?7) look like kinds of intelligence. They look more like the sorts of evidence that indicate the extent of one's deviation from the norm. However, I would need a bit of a walk-through to understand the 'evolutionary' and the 'symbol' systems. tell us more.

[maryportfuncity 10,030]

In the great West Cumbria tradition I'll wait for the social worker to tell me which one I am and how much in benefits I gain as a result.

[Brinsworth House Baiter 12]

Oh I fall into the second category, without a doubt.

 

I know this because they told me as they were taking off the electrodes after running all those tests that time.

[TLC 9]

It is said that there are seven different kinds of intellegence. I believe the first option doesn't even qualify.

 

Potential isolation by brain damage.

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals.

An identifiable core operation or set of operations.

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances.

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility.

Support from experimental psychological tasks.

Support from psychometric findings.

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system.

Is the list supposed to show different ways of being able to prove intelligence in beings, as I don't see this list of 'intelligences' as mutually exclusive, insofar as I understand any of it.

 

I presume you've labelled 7 options on purpose because you've not counted the first option on the list of 8? Although in that case, whoever originally said 'it' (is it the 'they' from 'you know what they say' again?) can't count as their list must include all 8 as options or they wouldn't all be on the list. I think.

 

Cut & paste can be a double-edged sword sometimes, can't it?

 

I'd say the whole list sounds very much like it should be under the tag-line Corporate Intelligence Solutions or such like. The use of 'end-state' alerted me to this possibility.

At the moment i'm trying to find which intellegence is of my own. Which belongs to you?

My intelligence belongs to me, whatever its label. Or its worth, for that matter.

 

I worry that you think the above list might help explain yours.

[Brinsworth House Baiter 12]

Wow, like that is really, really heavy, TLC. Almost, I imagine, intellectual. Perhaps philosophical. Maby even eminent in a field full of bulls.

 

I can not really comment as I don't understand a F*****g word of it, thus probably reducing my level of intelligence to that of the farm hand who has to shovel up after all the bulls- but it has impressed me to the point that I have reached for the Rizlas and I shall re-read and re-read it until I do understand it*. Your post that is, as against the Rizla packet.

 

*Or until I doze off and set the sofa on fire.

 

P.S. Can a mod or someone change the spelling mistake in the thread title or am I missing some intended, intelligent irony on Banshee's part?

[TLC 9]

Wow, like that is really, really heavy, TLC. Almost, I imagine, intellectual. Perhaps philosophical. Maby even eminent in a field full of bulls.

 

I can not really comment as I don't understand a F*****g word of it, thus probably reducing my level of intelligence to that of the farm hand who has to shovel up after all the bulls- but it has impressed me to the point that I have reached for the Rizlas and I shall re-read and re-read it until I do understand it*. Your post that is, as against the Rizla packet.

 

*Or until I doze off and set the sofa on fire.

This is the sort of stuff that I write because my Rizla+ are at home along with my gear, field of bulls was the closest guess.

P.S. Can a mod or someone change the spelling mistake in the thread title or am I missing some intended, intelligent irony on Banshee's part?

Yes they can, no you're not.

[Brinsworth House Baiter 12]

P.S. Can a mod or someone change the spelling the mistake in the thread title or am I missing some intended, intelligent irony on Banshee's part?

 

Yes they can, no you're not.

 

Thank you for quoting that as it has brought to my attention my own grammatical error, which I have now rushed back into the original post and corrected. Although my slack ways will forever be evident in your quote, which is not necessarily a bad thing as I occasionally enjoy bringing attention to my slackness.

[The Pooka 25]

In the days that I had to study this sort of thing, the best definition of 'intelligence' that I saw was by Heim who described it as, 'the ability to grasp the essentials in a given situation and respond accordingly'. I always thought that definition took account of common sense and the ability to survive in the real world.

[honez 79]

Can a mod or someone change the spelling mistake in the thread title

Not a problum. I don't minde doing it.

[TLC 9]

In the days that I had to study this sort of thing, the best definition of 'intelligence' that I saw was by Heim who described it as, 'the ability to grasp the essentials in a given situation and respond accordingly'. I always thought that definition took account of common sense and the ability to survive in the real world.

Some questions for you Mr Pooka, from an eager student..

 

The first part (ability to grasp the essentials in a given situation) to me suggests intelligence, whereas 'responding accordingly' would be common sense or wisdom, to me a distinct...thingy.

 

Is intelligence merely the comprehension of what's happening without necessarily knowing the best way (or a sensible way) to respond? Even if in theory the various possible responses can be worked out?

 

If so, can you begin to call computers intelligent if the ability to respond is 'common sense' and separate?

 

Are common sense and intelligence merely two sides to the same coin?*

 

I suppose it depends on your definition of intelligence, at which point the argument starts to become a little circular.

 

A quote I heard once was 'intelligence tells you it's raining, common sense tells you to open your umbrella'.

 

*You'd never think that if you've ever met any of the 'hyper-intelligent but can't do their own shoelaces up without falling over' type of student that is very common. Two different coins entirely.

[The Pooka 25]

In the days that I had to study this sort of thing, the best definition of 'intelligence' that I saw was by Heim who described it as, 'the ability to grasp the essentials in a given situation and respond accordingly'. I always thought that definition took account of common sense and the ability to survive in the real world.

Some questions for you Mr Pooka, from an eager student..

 

The first part (ability to grasp the essentials in a given situation) to me suggests intelligence, whereas 'responding accordingly' would be common sense or wisdom, to me a distinct...thingy.

 

Is intelligence merely the comprehension of what's happening without necessarily knowing the best way (or a sensible way) to respond? Even if in theory the various possible responses can be worked out?

 

If so, can you begin to call computers intelligent if the ability to respond is 'common sense' and separate?

 

Are common sense and intelligence merely two sides to the same coin?*

 

I suppose it depends on your definition of intelligence, at which point the argument starts to become a little circular.

 

A quote I heard once was 'intelligence tells you it's raining, common sense tells you to open your umbrella'.

 

*You'd never think that if you've ever met any of the 'hyper-intelligent but can't do their own shoelaces up without falling over' type of student that is very common. Two different coins entirely.

I suppose what Heim was saying was that intelligence involved having a nervous system that equipped you well to exist as a human (or whatever other species you belonged to). Heim's definiton excluded mere knowledge or performance at tests as constituting intelligence. What you refer to as common sense had to be an element. The definition also excluded the sad chacters who believed that membership of Mensa, in its own right, indicated intelligence. What they were doing was confirming the cynic's definition, 'Intelligence is what intelligence tests measure'.

[BrunoBrimley 83]

I have absolutely no understanding of this entire discussion; however, I decided to drop in as a sign of support for Japser Larkspur and to inquire about what flavor is each persons favorite ice cream...

[TLC 9]

I suppose what Heim was saying was that intelligence involved having a nervous system that equipped you well to exist as a human (or whatever other species you belonged to). Heim's definiton excluded mere knowledge or performance at tests as constituting intelligence. What you refer to as common sense had to be an element. The definition also excluded the sad characters who believed that membership of Mensa, in its own right, indicated intelligence. What they were doing was confirming the cynic's definition, 'Intelligence is what intelligence tests measure'.

Good stuff, I think I can follow that. As it happens, I'm extremely good at doing all of those Mensa type tests, but I agree that it just proves I'm good at Mensa tests. Put me in a room full of people and I don't stand out as some ultra-intelligent chap, except perhaps if there's a pop quiz going on.... or a Mensa test. The fact is I've probably got a high IQ but the tying of shoelaces (not literally) I find much more tricky, along with understanding people, getting on with my work, motivation, drive, ambition, perseverence etc.

 

I'd be the one standing out in the rain telling everyone why it's raining and how it happens whilst forgetting to put my umbrella up.

 

[shrink's chair]I've basically spent most of my 32 years working out how to cover up all of the huge holes in my common sense by trying to work out how other people react, and so acting within the boundaries of what seems to be considered acceptable. Sometimes near the extremes of acceptable, I don't mean I just do the complete average all of the time, I hope that's reasonably obvious from my posting on this site. Also, other than smile=happy, frown=sad/puzzled type stuff I have no understanding of body language, not even subconsciously. Even if people spell stuff out to me I just presume they're probably taking the piss. I've read books on it and can probably tell people the theory behind certain expressions, posture, stance etc. but I can't pick it up in practice. I'm Mr. Theory, effectively. Not the greatest superhero name ever I'll admit; and with my devastating powers of 'careful theoretical observation' not the most useful one. Nice costume though. [/shrink's chair]

 

Great; I think I've just successfully argued that I'm a computer and as such have no intelligence.

 

My favourite flavour of ice cream? It depends....

[Banshees Scream 107]

These following 8 are based on intellegence, a theory that states each human being should have one of the above. This seems to be one of Deathlists intellectual threads. Under your judgement which of these sounds most equivelent to your intellegence? I will rephrase...

 

Potential isolation by brain damage. - Damage or injury\ disease?

 

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals. - Genius, Brillient. As a child usually.

 

An identifiable core operation or set of operations. - A way of organization. Moderation. Following steps. Discipline

 

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances. - Grow to understand, Learning from experience, Possible skill brought on by failure, cleverness by aging.

 

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility. - No restrain. Expected success. Born into a kind of industry, Failure is not an option. 'High mind' 'Not illegally but naturally'

 

Support from experimental psychological tasks. - Looks for explanation. Scientific, Hunger for evidence, , could be unimaginative and unreligious

 

Support from psychometric findings. - Up to date, Accepts what is said, No argument.

 

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system. - Very sensative. Deep thought. Images usually lead them to understanding. Dreamer

 

Instead of calling this 'Intellegence' I will say a 'Way Of Thinking' these are ways of thinking. Now from what I have described, if you can, which cycle of thinking might you have?

[Banshees Scream 107]

P.S. Can a mod or someone change the spelling mistake in the thread title or am I missing some intended, intelligent irony on Banshee's part?

 

Honez had one of his Literate Laughs I see.

[The Pooka 25]

Also, other than smile=happy, frown=sad/puzzled type stuff I have no understanding of body language, not even subconsciously. Even if people spell stuff out to me I just presume they're probably taking the piss. I've read books on it and can probably tell people the theory behind certain expressions, posture, stance etc. but I can't pick it up in practice. I'm Mr. Theory, effectively. Not the greatest superhero name ever I'll admit; and with my devastating powers of 'careful theoretical observation' not the most useful one. Nice costume though. [/shrink's chair]

 

Great; I think I've just successfully argued that I'm a computer and as such have no intelligence.

 

My favourite flavour of ice cream? It depends....

 

Well TLC........... that bit sounds like Autism / Asperger's type stuff. But then a friend of mine who is a psychologist (a female one, as was Heim) argues that autism is just a fairly extreme form of masculine thinking. I don't really know. Its just that the difficulty in gauging people's emotional responses sounds typical. My friend might be right though about males and autism...... I was driving the other day and tried to work out my travel expenses in my head. When I reached 12 decimal points I realised that I had calculated to 1/100 billionth of a penny. That's not intelligent - that's autistic.

[The Pooka 25]

These following 8 are based on intellegence, a theory that states each human being should have one of the above. This seems to be one of Deathlists intellectual threads. Under your judgement which of these sounds most equivelent to your intellegence? I will rephrase...

 

Potential isolation by brain damage. - Damage or injury\ disease?

 

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals. - Genius, Brillient. As a child usually.

 

An identifiable core operation or set of operations. - A way of organization. Moderation. Following steps. Discipline

 

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances. - Grow to understand, Learning from experience, Possible skill brought on by failure, cleverness by aging.

 

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility. - No restrain. Expected success. Born into a kind of industry, Failure is not an option. 'High mind' 'Not illegally but naturally'

 

Support from experimental psychological tasks. - Looks for explanation. Scientific, Hunger for evidence, , could be unimaginative and unreligious

 

Support from psychometric findings. - Up to date, Accepts what is said, No argument.

 

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system. - Very sensative. Deep thought. Images usually lead them to understanding. Dreamer

 

Instead of calling this 'Intellegence' I will say a 'Way Of Thinking' these are ways of thinking. Now from what I have described, if you can, which cycle of thinking might you have?

Well that's clearer even if I wouldn't agree with all of the qualification in italics.

 

Just to muddy the waters there is a whole industry based around 'Emotional Intelligence' these days (Goleman is the big cheese). This argues that there is a type of intelligence based on 4 qualities: self-awareness, self-management, social awareness and social skills. Apparently this has twice as much bearing on career performance as either IQ or technical skills.

 

I'm finding it difficult to categorise myself using this so will revert to answering what I can answer. Bruno - I have, once or twice, had a stem ginger and vanilla ice cream. It is my favourite.

[Banshees Scream 107]

These following 8 are based on intellegence, a theory that states each human being should have one of the above. This seems to be one of Deathlists intellectual threads. Under your judgement which of these sounds most equivelent to your intellegence? I will rephrase...

 

Potential isolation by brain damage. - Damage or injury\ disease?

 

The existence of idiots savants, prodigies and other exceptional individuals. - Genius, Brillient. As a child usually.

 

An identifiable core operation or set of operations. - A way of organization. Moderation. Following steps. Discipline

 

A distinctive development history, along with a definable set of 'end-state' performances. - Grow to understand, Learning from experience, Possible skill brought on by failure, cleverness by aging.

 

An evolutionary history and evolutionary plausibility. - No restrain. Expected success. Born into a kind of industry, Failure is not an option. 'High mind' 'Not illegally but naturally'

 

Support from experimental psychological tasks. - Looks for explanation. Scientific, Hunger for evidence, , could be unimaginative and unreligious

 

Support from psychometric findings. - Up to date, Accepts what is said, No argument.

 

Susceptibility to encoding in a symbol system. - Very sensative. Deep thought. Images usually lead them to understanding. Dreamer

 

Instead of calling this 'Intellegence' I will say a 'Way Of Thinking' these are ways of thinking. Now from what I have described, if you can, which cycle of thinking might you have?

Well that's clearer even if I wouldn't agree with all of the qualification in italics.

 

Just to muddy the waters there is a whole industry based around 'Emotional Intelligence' these days (Goleman is the big cheese). This argues that there is a type of intelligence based on 4 qualities: self-awareness, self-management, social awareness and social skills. Apparently this has twice as much bearing on career performance as either IQ or technical skills.

 

 

From what you have said, as I see it.. There are only two catagorys. Self awareness and social awareness. They are underlined and the following suggestions should go below them.

[The Pooka 25]

Well that's clearer even if I wouldn't agree with all of the qualification in italics.

 

Just to muddy the waters there is a whole industry based around 'Emotional Intelligence' these days (Goleman is the big cheese). This argues that there is a type of intelligence based on 4 qualities: self-awareness, self-management, social awareness and social skills. Apparently this has twice as much bearing on career performance as either IQ or technical skills.

 

 

From what you have said, as I see it.. There are only two catagorys. Self awareness and social awareness. They are underlined and the following suggestions should go below them.

Well self-awareness is about your knowledge of yourself (eg I get angry very quickly) whereas self-management is about how you interact externally, cope with your emotions etc (eg how you manage to control your anger and direct it away from self-limiting behaviour like telling the boss to F**k off). Social awareness is about being aware of group / team interactions, noting how people behave in social situations (eg being aware that X cannot work with Y without rowing) whereas social skills are more about managing the situations of which you are aware (eg finding ways of getting the best out of X and Y). So two categories are about 'knowing' (=K) and two are about 'doing' (D) and two are about the individual (I) and two about the individual's social environment (S). ie IK - ID - SK - SD. God i'm even boring myself now.

 

Ben and Jerry's Cherry Carcia is another favourite of mine.

[Banshees Scream 107]

Not that I can say Pooka, but within a forum that is not seen by regular members... something like this sounds very familiar.

[Brinsworth House Baiter 12]

P.S. Can a mod or someone change the spelling mistake in the thread title or am I missing some intended, intelligent irony on Banshee's part?

 

Honez had one of his Literate Laughs I see.

 

Banshees, that was me who pointed that out, or are you suggesting that Honez has nobbled the spelling? I find that hard to believe, seeing as you are continously misspelling 'intelligence' in every post you submit on this thread.

 

Please note the correct spelling as the overwhelming irony is killing me.

[TLC 9]

Also, other than smile=happy, frown=sad/puzzled type stuff I have no understanding of body language, not even subconsciously. Even if people spell stuff out to me I just presume they're probably taking the piss. I've read books on it and can probably tell people the theory behind certain expressions, posture, stance etc. but I can't pick it up in practice. I'm Mr. Theory, effectively. Not the greatest superhero name ever I'll admit; and with my devastating powers of 'careful theoretical observation' not the most useful one. Nice costume though. [/shrink's chair]

 

Great; I think I've just successfully argued that I'm a computer and as such have no intelligence.

 

My favourite flavour of ice cream? It depends....

 

Well TLC........... that bit sounds like Autism / Asperger's type stuff. But then a friend of mine who is a psychologist (a female one, as was Heim) argues that autism is just a fairly extreme form of masculine thinking. I don't really know. Its just that the difficulty in gauging people's emotional responses sounds typical. My friend might be right though about males and autism...... I was driving the other day and tried to work out my travel expenses in my head. When I reached 12 decimal points I realised that I had calculated to 1/100 billionth of a penny. That's not intelligent - that's autistic.

Just scored 16 on the Asperger's test, 16.4 is the average and 30 ish is Asperger's alert time. Not that it proves anything, I got the same as BS which surprised me a little....

 

I'm kind of ok in real life though, I'm not obviously odd in social situations, mostly.

 

I often do the same with the maths, I tell myself it's to keep my brain in shape by not using a calculator but it's not is it?

[Banshees Scream 107]

Also, other than smile=happy, frown=sad/puzzled type stuff I have no understanding of body language, not even subconsciously. Even if people spell stuff out to me I just presume they're probably taking the piss. I've read books on it and can probably tell people the theory behind certain expressions, posture, stance etc. but I can't pick it up in practice. I'm Mr. Theory, effectively. Not the greatest superhero name ever I'll admit; and with my devastating powers of 'careful theoretical observation' not the most useful one. Nice costume though. [/shrink's chair]

 

Great; I think I've just successfully argued that I'm a computer and as such have no intelligence.

 

My favourite flavour of ice cream? It depends....

 

Well TLC........... that bit sounds like Autism / Asperger's type stuff. But then a friend of mine who is a psychologist (a female one, as was Heim) argues that autism is just a fairly extreme form of masculine thinking. I don't really know. Its just that the difficulty in gauging people's emotional responses sounds typical. My friend might be right though about males and autism...... I was driving the other day and tried to work out my travel expenses in my head. When I reached 12 decimal points I realised that I had calculated to 1/100 billionth of a penny. That's not intelligent - that's autistic.

Just scored 16 on the Asperger's test, 16.4 is the average and 30 ish is Asperger's alert time. Not that it proves anything, I got the same as BS which surprised me a little....

 

I'm kind of ok in real life though, I'm not obviously odd in social situations, mostly.

 

I often do the same with the maths, I tell myself it's to keep my brain in shape by not using a calculator but it's not is it?

 

I don't have that disease. Although I know of somebody who was diagnosed with it. I believe it involves the nervous system.