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RoverAndOut

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RoverAndOut last won the day on November 21 2020

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About RoverAndOut

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  1. RoverAndOut

    Scavenger Hunt Bingo Deadpool III

    Doesn't end the game but puts both @Death Impends and @An Fear Beag 1 Eurovision performer away from victory. It's not going to last as long as the first two games, but the same twists and turns and race for the finish line is still on!
  2. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    I know this isn't the headline to the post, but are you telling me that, not only is Trump going to die of Covid, but so are Blair, Clinton AND Monica?!
  3. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Agreed that they're all opportunists who just tack to the prevailing wind but the reason it's important is that if McConnell says he should be impeached it provides political cover to other moderate Republicans who might be feeling that way. More importantly, McConnell still controls the business in the Senate until Inauguration Day next Wednesday, so if the House passes the Article of Impeachment, a Senate trial could potentially be expedited and held before Trump leaves office if McConnell decided to. Not that it really matters, the main aim of this impeachment, aside from sending a message that you can't incite a mob to invade the Capitol (which apparently needs spelling out), is the possibility of disqualifying Trump from ever running for office again.
  4. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Impeachment doesn't mean you're federally barred from office, nor is it a requirement for someone to be federally barred from office. The two things are separate. As I said before, one of the arguments being made for pursuing impeachment is that it would be a useful fact-finding exercise if you were looking to bar him from office. This could be achieved in other ways and since he is being investigated in several states and now DC for inciting a riot in the Capitol, not to mention any federal crimes he may or may not pardon himself for, and the fact he has faced an impeachment trial already in his term, I wouldn't say another attempt is crucial to this aim. Not to mention, as I pointed out, it is nigh on impossible for a impeachment trial to be conducted within a week (the House could vote on Wednesday, the Inauguration is a week on Wednesday). It's a clever line, but lacks any understanding of the American political system. There are not 18 Republican Senators who entertain thoughts of running for President in 4 years time. There were 17 candidates in 2016 and only 5 were Senators and one wasn't even still in the Senate. Add to that that 74 million people voted for Trump 3 months ago and regardless of the events of the past week, you're going to have to convince a lot of people who voted for Trump that you deserve the nomination. Voting to impeach their leader is probably not your best strategy for winning the nomination. Finally, what right-minded Republican Senator wants to try and pick their way through the civil war that is about to engulf the Republican party and try and form a winning coalition in 2024? In short, there are not going to be 18 Republican senators who will vote to convict Trump, even if there were it wouldn't bar him from office, and even if it did, the Senate won't hold an impeachment trial this side of Inauguration, after which time I doubt they'll bother anyway.
  5. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    It's been suggested that impeachment hearings could be held to gather evidence in order for him to be barred from standing for public office in the future. That way, he wouldn't be able to run in 2024 anyway. Same may happen to Don Jr. Of course, if the DC Prosecutor chooses to pursue Trump as the agitator of the riot, then plenty of evidence to that effect would be gathered that way also. Not as simple as that. Impeachment requires a supermajority not a simple majority - 2/3rds of the Senate, so 67 votes not 51. Currently, the Senate is made up of 51 Republicans, 46 Democrats and 2 Independents who vote with the Democrats (Bernie Sanders being one of them). The remaining seat is currently vacant and belongs to David Perdue, the Senator from Georgia whose election has at this time not yet been decided (as the Democrats haven't been sworn in yet: Kelly Loeffler, the other Senator from Georgia who also faced election gets to continue in her seat as she's technically a caretaker for the seat, not a sitting Senator, despite the fact she has just lost an election - that's the simple explanation anyway). It's not yet certain when Warnock and Ossoff will be sworn in and until that happens, the Democrats are two votes further down. So at present, they'd need the 48 votes they currently have, plus another 18 Republican votes (66 would be enough for two thirds in a 99-seat Senate). If the two Georgia seats were filled then they'd need 17 Republican votes. Murkowski, Collins and Romney is 3. That leaves 14 more out of the remaining 47 or 48. Ben Sasse has suggested he thinks there reason to impeach this time, but where are the other votes going to come from? Plenty think it's not worth the personal political cost to them since he's out in a fortnight anyway. Pelosi is getting on with it, the article for 'Incitement of Insurrection' will be introduced on Monday and voted on on Tuesday or Wednesday, but it's unlikely to get any further as McConnell, for now, still controls the Senate and Lindsay Graham the Judiciary Committee. They only have to delay a week and it's Inauguration Day. Of course, as discussed he may be impeached post-inauguration, but I doubt it. Best chance of him going is either he's convinced to resign (unlikely) or Pence invokes the 25th Amendment (also seems unlikely, like everyone else, the Cabinet are just waiting for Inauguration Day, not to mention half the Cabinet Secretaries have been sacked or quit since the election so it's not entirely clear who's left to vote to invoke 25 anyway).
  6. RoverAndOut

    James Bond 007 (Connery/Moore/Villains etc)

    I remember reading the same thing. Definitely sounded like he fancied his chances of making 70 Up, which would, of course, have been the 10th edition. No mention on the BBC report of a cause of death, but must have been fairly quick.
  7. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Doubtless they'll be back. According to the true believers, it was Antifa infiltrators that instigated the violence. Oh, and the latest Trump video where he concedes is, of course, deep faked. Either that or he's being held hostage in the White House and being forced to make these statements. Honestly. This is what they're saying, I'm not making it up.
  8. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Only because he's realised he's gone too far and there are consequences. He's trying to save his own skin as per usual. This was the speech that he needed to make yesterday. Damage is done. And when he realises that, is he really going to change? Listening to some of the Republicans in Congress, it's already business as usual again.
  9. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    No, I think @Joey Russ is correct. The question at the top is whether the respondents agreed with the storming of the Capitol. The results are then divided into subsets: All voters, registered Democrats, registered Independents, registered Republicans and then finally Voters who believe that fraud decided the election (they may be Dems, Indys or Reps). You're confusing the bottom line with being a separate question. And I agree, you'd assume it to be nearer to 100% but not according to this survey.
  10. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Don't insult my intelligence. I've got two degrees myself, one in History and Politics and an M.A. in History. I don't throw my education around, it's not necessary to do so. I'm perfectly aware of Godwin's Law and assumed that would be the thing to pick up on. I do not expect American democracy to crumble overnight, but if you think everything is tickety-boo with US institutions at this moment in time, then I would suggest you look a bit closer. Public trust in their institutions is at an all-time low, misinformation is rampant. The divide between left and right has been larger before but the animosity and distrust that both sides feel towards each other is worse than it's been in years - remember in other significant crises like Watergate, even the majority of Republicans believed Nixon was guilty. The partisanship that emerged in the 90s with Clinton and Gingrich has been ramped up by perceived, or real, injustices, particularly since the 2008 financial crash. In 2008, Obama was elected and Palin was unleashed onto the national stage. In 2010, the Tea Party became a political force. By 2012, Birtherism was a thing, despite Obama releasing his entire birth certificate. In 2016, Trump won the Republican nomination and then the presidency. In 2020, Trump supporters refuse to accept the result of the election and storm the Capitol Building. Trump isn't disappearing any time soon. Is that not a pattern? He'll have plenty to say post-presidency, whether that's with his TV Network or wherever. His supporters won't disappear, because this isn't just about Trump. It's about QAnon, it's about anti-vaxxers and coronavirus. It's about all these myriad of reasons why people feel violated or disenfranchised. You're right, the United States will most likely survive. It is a 'very resilient country with a strong democracy and strong institutions'. But it still had to fight a Civil War 150 years ago (the flag of the secessionists made it into the Capitol Building for the first time in history today). It also survived the 1960s, but not without the death of a President, a frontrunning candidate and 2 iconic civil rights leaders. I wouldn't consider that a particularly stable democracy. I sincerely hope that this is the watershed. The dying of the light. The point where those who have been ambivalent about Trump and his antics draw the line and say 'no more'. But the fact it got to this point is itself damning. I wish I could just laugh it off and dismiss it as you do. But haven't we laughed off enough in the past decade plus and ended up at this point?
  11. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Agree with a lot of what you say on here but I do wonder just how much longer people need to calm down and there's nothing to see here. The President of the United States has instigated a riot that has resulted in the occupation of the Legislature of the United States and the death of a woman. Biden may well be inaugurated as expected but these people and their anger doesn't just disappear overnight, particularly when the exiting President is still encouraging them and feeding their paranoia.In October, the FBI arrested men plotting to kidnap the Governor of Michigan and put her on trial for treason. Today, armed gangs have been seen outside the count in Georgia for the two Senate Special Elections, causing state election officials to evacuate. This is not normal and it shouldn't be dismissed. The Munich Beer Hall Putsch was similarly ridiculous and unsuccessful, but the long term consequences were dire.
  12. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    Make America Great Again. Something that actually does need to happen now.
  13. RoverAndOut

    Donald J Trump

    The whole thing is a Virtual Insanity though.
  14. RoverAndOut

    Scavenger Hunt Bingo Deadpool III

    Colin Bell another miss in here. Have we lost our touch? (Waiting for a winning hit tomorrow now...)
  15. RoverAndOut

    The DL Prediction Game 2021

    Well most of us put a Captain in front of Tom Moore, what more do you want?! Sheesh!
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