Canadian Paul 97 Posted December 12, 2006 For those of us gazing at the above two posts in confusion could someone involved - like - describe roughly what was on the now disabled link? I saw it. Picking the person in the link would have made picking the subject of this thread look like picking Maurice Papon. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Octopus of Odstock 2,187 Posted December 13, 2006 I may have been a little OTT in the SS comparison yesterday. I wasn't comparing certain Deathlisters to the SS, merely drawing similarities with the reasoning and justifications. I'm sure most SS members would have drawn the line at listing her. No, the SS would've shot her first and left her to rot in the midday sun. Anyway, I've made my decision. When this story first broke on the BBC, I thought to myself "hmmm.. unique pick, a bit close to the knuckle, but I'll consider it". Then the story evolved, so I thought more chance of an obit. But then the story snowballed into double spreads & front page news. Mass debate on here too. No unique pick, for sure. I've thought about this rationally (not easy with Godot's holier than thou attitude shining from his sunny arse above) and decided that she will be taken off the list. The main reason, essentially, is, the following Do I care about Miss Grove? No. She's never been in my life before, she won't be after. I wish her well but her illness and death is of no consequence to me. Will her death torment me? Maybe a little bit. But I'll get over it. The same Godot rejoiced in Ross Davidson's demise. If she becomes well, or lasts for longer than hoped, what then? This is the crucial bit. If she takes treatment again, which I see happening, or keeps on fighting, my natural reaction SHOULD be "good for you". But it won't as she'll be on the DDP team, and that's the bit I have trouble with. and that's why I've decided to take her off the list. Bruce Sewell too. Although 24 points is a heck of a lot, if it means I finish 10th or 17th or around that mark, than finish 3rd but allegedly "tainted" then so be it. The final reason for taking her off: I'm not convinced she'll get an obit even if she does go. She's not just not famous, she's below that mark But to those who do pick her, good luck. I no longer have no opinion on her either way, and go back to not caring a jot about her. No doubt Godot will now take this as a personal victory and strut & preen himself, a la de Gaulle, or a chicken, conveninetly wiping off that Ross Davidson smear on his coat whilst he does so.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godot 149 Posted December 13, 2006 I may have been a little OTT in the SS comparison yesterday. I wasn't comparing certain Deathlisters to the SS, merely drawing similarities with the reasoning and justifications. I'm sure most SS members would have drawn the line at listing her. No doubt Godot will now take this as a personal victory and strut & preen himself, a la de Gaulle, or a chicken, conveninetly wiping off that Ross Davidson smear on his coat whilst he does so.... I'm truly perplexed by this OoO. So much so that I went back to the RD thread to see what I'd said at the time. Apart from a bit of banter with our original informant "Candie Bar" about the possible tunes at Ross's funeral I didn't have much to say. I thought he was a nonentity before and after his death and, because of that, felt a bit guilty for picking him. But there was no strutting or preening then or now. I think I explained my opinions about Josie here and I received a lot of flack for it including an observation that I should not assume to have any friends here. I was surprised at the strength of the invective. But I thought independence of mind was to be encouraged in these threads and I shall continue to say what I think. I happen to have a lot of admiration for your input. But I do think that you and all the other left brainers have a blind spot that became apparent in this thread. You get carried away by the thirst for points. It's implicit again in your post above. Points and the game - nothing else matters. Except that you know you are not wholly left brained (unlike Rotten Ali who lives in his duffle bag) and that's clear too in your reasoning above. I see the same attitude at the top of many companies where the bosses believe that the bottom line is the only consideration. It's why we have tasteless food in supermarkets and homogeneous high streets. Everything is the same. That would happen to the Deathlist if all we did was list the world's oldest and obscure people with cancer. I wasn't grandstanding or claiming the moral high ground. How could I? I have a cancer ward (that's doing rather well in the HDP, even without Paul Hunter). I said where I stood re the listing of Josie and that hasn't changed. It's pretty plane that whether I think you're a worm or not is of no consequence to you. So why worry? But, for the record, I'm delighted OoO, but not surprised, to discover you are not a worm. I wonder how many names there will be in Godot's New Year list of DL worms? Very few I'd wager. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Octopus of Odstock 2,187 Posted December 13, 2006 I'm truly perplexed by this OoO. So much so that I went back to the RD thread to see what I'd said at the time. Apart from a bit of banter with our original informant "Candie Bar" about the possible tunes at Ross's funeral I didn't have much to say. I thought he was a nonentity before and after his death and, because of that, felt a bit guilty for picking him. But there was no strutting or preening then or now. I think I explained my opinions about Josie here and I received a lot of flack for it including an observation that I should not assume to have any friends here. I was surprised at the strength of the invective. But I thought independence of mind was to be encouraged in these threads and I shall continue to say what I think. I happen to have a lot of admiration for your input. But I do think that you and all the other left brainers have a blind spot that became apparent in this thread. You get carried away by the thirst for points. It's implicit again in your post above. Points and the game - nothing else matters. Except that you know you are not wholly left brained (unlike Rotten Ali who lives in his duffle bag) and that's clear too in your reasoning above. I wasn't grandstanding or claiming the moral high ground. How could I? I have a cancer ward (that's doing rather well in the HDP, even without Paul Hunter). I said where I stood re the listing of Josie and that hasn't changed. It's pretty plane that whether I think you're a worm or not is of no consequence to you. So why worry? But, for the record, I'm delighted OoO, but not surprised, to discover you are not a worm. I wonder how many names there will be in Godot's New Year list of DL worms? Very few I'd wager. A fair answer Godot. It deserves a fair reply. It was all about the notion of bravery and the personal attack on someone who hadn't even picked the girl. Maybe I shouldn't have got involved, but it seemed to me that you were attacking someone for picking a candidate based on their illness alone. That I found incredulous, given the "cancer team". I suppose, if I am going to be fair to you, the fact is I am wrestling with you in my subconsious. You are my "good", I am my "bad". There have been certain deaths this year, which have made me think again about DP'ing. Not about the whole thing, but just who I pick. Ma><ine Edgington's daughter, Josie's family, Paul Hunter's widow & baby child, Richard Burns' family, the so sad personal loss of someone famous (Len Sutton), the incredibly tragic loss of a personal friend of a brain tumour at just 20-F*****g-5, and likewise the death of a cousin, in a coma after a stroke, aged only 47. It strikes something in me. The Ross Davidson "thing" is the epitome of that. We treated him shambocially. Respect has been given to Josie. None to Ross. Yes, you can say Ross drank too much, was not the best actor, and made a mess of his first marriage. But the strength, the sheer bravery that man had to accept his terminal diagnosis & make the last days for his son & his wife comfortable, forgoing everything else... well, I'll be honest - I was blown away. What a man. That explained - I found it hard how you could take, or appear to take, the moral high ground over others based solely on the diagnosis of someone's terminal illness. Please do continue to say what you think. I think we all should. But the SS thing enraged me. These were people who not only would've killed Josie, but her whole family, stripped them naked, looted them, then left them to rot in the streets. How you could even compare them to people who are thinking about putting her on a DDP list (and that is all they are doing), on the back of claiming a bit of moral one-upness really made me fume. It's not the sense of points, per se. It's more - if I do something, I like to do it well. DP'ing as well as work, life, everything. I don't like to come last if I can help it. But I will rather take 3rd from 15 oldie hits, than 1st from 6 oldie hits, Josie & Bruce Sewell. There's more satisfaction for me in that. For what it's worth, I'm still having terrible moral problems with even putting Tammy Faye in. But not enough to leave her out. I hope this makes things clearer? I still, and will continue to, think that attacking CP & comparisons to the SS were a step too far, even in this case. But I would hate for you to be quietened and be all PR-like. There's enough on this board already. That's it in a nutshell, I think. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
themaninblack 2,112 Posted December 13, 2006 When it comes to it, there is no absolute rule for death, when it happens. If we start making rules for what types of people and what types of death shouldn't be in, then we are negating the very point of the death pool. Maybe there should be some sort of death arbitration panel, which would pass judgement on what would be acceptable to the DDP, DL or any other dead pool floating in cyberspace... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Godot 149 Posted December 13, 2006 CP has deleted the post in which he attacked me but he knows what he said. I admitted to punching below the belt in reply but he is a student after all so he can take it. I have no grudge with CP or anyone here apart from Weatherman 90 and that's not much of a grudge. The SS thing is bound to make the blood boil. But I think there are comparisons to be made about the mental mechanisms that allow people to short circuit their basic human values. There is a good book on the subject called Hitler's Willing Executioners, Ordinary Germans And The Holocaust by Daniel Goldhagen. I do not subscribe to the idea that all Germans were bad or, indeed that all members of the SS were intrinsically bad although they did bad things. I do think that the excuse: "We were only obeying orders" was a genuine sentiment for many. If you interpret that as "we were only deferring accountability" you might see what I'm getting at. Tammy Faye will be on my HDP list which this year is going to be more of an ailments list to hoover up the coma victims. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Octopus of Odstock 2,187 Posted December 29, 2006 Update - the response from the news has "given her life purpose". Link and also Tony Blair is supporting her. Blair backs Josie If Bliar is backing her, she's done for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maryportfuncity 10,645 Posted December 30, 2006 He feels sympathy, he's not got much longer than her, politically speaking. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maryportfuncity 10,645 Posted January 1, 2007 See our lass is a popular little joker pick on the DDP entries already revealed. Wonder if that'll stimulate the drive-by ranter fire when she goes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grobler 35 Posted January 1, 2007 See our lass is a popular little joker pick on the DDP entries already revealed. Wonder if that'll stimulate the drive-by ranter fire when she goes. you mean "if" she goes......we have another Tomlinson here I think....and I reckon all those who have picked her should be ashamed . Ashamed at lack of knowledge I mean....not Ashamed due to "being a sicko".....I'm a firm believer in anyone is fair game . I just dont see her as a candidate.....and as for those who've wasted the joker.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
football_fan 42 Posted January 1, 2007 I just dont see her as a candidate.....and as for those who've wasted the joker.... I beg to disagree. She is definitely a goner Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grobler 35 Posted January 1, 2007 I just dont see her as a candidate.....and as for those who've wasted the joker.... I beg to disagree. She is definitely a goner maybe a gooner...but not a goner... Though I bow to your recent successes in picking.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grobler 35 Posted January 1, 2007 I just dont see her as a candidate.....and as for those who've wasted the joker.... I beg to disagree. She is definitely a goner maybe a gooner...but not a goner... Though I bow to your recent successes in picking.... just noticed FF , that you are based in Canada , so your "football" might not be the same as mine...and hence my fantastically well crafted pun on "gooner" may well have passed you by....apologies.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Windsor 2,233 Posted January 2, 2007 Her last Christmas? Some nice photos to go along with it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Magere Hein 1,400 Posted January 2, 2007 Her last Christmas? Some nice photos to go along with it... Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. Did she know what she got herself in before she got all that attention? regards, Hein Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maryportfuncity 10,645 Posted January 2, 2007 I know what you mean. This whole business of dying in public has some very dodgy angles. There's a girl down south somewhere who battles cancer, meets celebs and puts it all on a web site. She's made the local press and raised funds for her hospice and Jane Tomlinson's raised a few quid but.....you've got to handle this stuff carefully. I thought John Diamond's books on cancer were superb, but he was a superb writer to start with. When it comes to people who are used by as much as using the media I'm not so sure. Does anyone remember Chris Morris' superb newspaper column in the nineties when he made out he was a journalist dying of cancer? Class. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Windsor 2,233 Posted January 2, 2007 Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. regards, Hein Indeed. She looks disgustingly healthy for a girl who is supposed to be dying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
football_fan 42 Posted January 2, 2007 Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. regards, Hein Indeed. She looks disgustingly healthy for a girl who is supposed to be dying. I would not only rely on those pictures. Dana Reeve looked very healthy and was still making appearances a few months before she died last year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Windsor 2,233 Posted January 2, 2007 Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. regards, Hein Indeed. She looks disgustingly healthy for a girl who is supposed to be dying. I would not only rely on those pictures. Dana Reeve looked very healthy and was still making appearances a few months before she died last year. I can see her surviving the year. If only for an even better Christmas paid for by the Daily Record next year... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handrejka 1,903 Posted January 2, 2007 I know what you mean. This whole business of dying in public has some very dodgy angles. There's a girl down south somewhere who battles cancer, meets celebs and puts it all on a web site. She's made the local press and raised funds for her hospice and Jane Tomlinson's raised a few quid but.....you've got to handle this stuff carefully. I thought John Diamond's books on cancer were superb, but he was a superb writer to start with. When it comes to people who are used by as much as using the media I'm not so sure. Does anyone remember Chris Morris' superb newspaper column in the nineties when he made out he was a journalist dying of cancer? Class. Was that the one were he said he was going to commit suicide on a certain date? Or am I thinking of something else? Sorry to go off topic. I've really nothing to say on Josie Groves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maryportfuncity 10,645 Posted January 2, 2007 The very one, I'd remembered it wrong. The 'joke' was he'd attempted suicide and the editors had forced him back to work where he wrote a column detailing the time up to and including his successful second suicide attempt. Worth a look even now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Guest Posted January 16, 2007 (edited) Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. regards, Hein Indeed. She looks disgustingly healthy for a girl who is supposed to be dying. Correctly. Left her out. Cause: http://www.thisisthenortheast.co.uk/mostpo...eatment.php?s=s or: ---------------- Posted by: Franci on 8:22am Wed 13 Dec 06 Dear Josie, I am bioenergy therapist ( healer) and I would like to help you . I just like you to know that I am helping you on a distance. The energy that you receive you can fell like warmth, pins and needels in your body or waving in individual parts of your body. It is not harmful and it can only feel you better . I am writing this here because I couldn´t find your e-mail. If you need any extra informations please contact me: lojzesi@*********.com Best wishes. Franci, Slovenija -------------------- But no reply from Josie... Best wishes, Franci Edited January 16, 2007 by Magere Hein Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Windsor 2,233 Posted January 16, 2007 Urgh. I'm glad I left her out of my team. regards, Hein Indeed. She looks disgustingly healthy for a girl who is supposed to be dying. Correctly. Left her out. Cause: http://www.thisisthenortheast.co.uk/mostpo...eatment.php?s=s or: ---------------- Posted by: Franci on 8:22am Wed 13 Dec 06 Dear Josie, I am bioenergy therapist ( healer) and I would like to help you . I just like you to know that I am helping you on a distance. The energy that you receive you can fell like warmth, pins and needels in your body or waving in individual parts of your body. It is not harmful and it can only feel you better . I am writing this here because I couldn´t find your e-mail. If you need any extra informations please contact me: lojzesi@*********.com Best wishes. Franci, Slovenija -------------------- But no reply from Josie... Best wishes, Franci I'm sending her bad vibes, so there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maryportfuncity 10,645 Posted January 16, 2007 I'm sending her a copy of Jane Tomlinson's book! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
