Somewhere Over The Rainbow

[themaninblack 2,112]

Stephen Gately's recent tragic death and that of Matt Lucas' ex Kevin McGee has got me thinking.

Prominent homosexuals do seem to have shorter lifespans. Even if you disregard the obvious AIDS tragedies that

have happened over the years, many known (or indeed not so 'known') homosexuals have come a cropper somewhat early.

 

I'm thinking radio DJ Kevin Greening who bought the farm last Christmas.

BBC presenter Christopher Price (Christopher who? You ask) who died suddenly in 2002.

 

Russel Harty and Kenneth Williams..

 

Montgomery Clift and James Dean..

 

Just a few examples...

[honez 79]

Stephen Gately's recent tragic death and that of Matt Lucas' ex Kevin McGee has got me thinking.

Prominent homosexuals do seem to have shorter lifespans. Even if you disregard the obvious AIDS tragedies that

have happened over the years, many known (or indeed not so 'known') homosexuals have come a cropper somewhat early.

 

I'm thinking radio DJ Kevin Greening who bought the farm last Christmas.

BBC presenter Christopher Price (Christopher who? You ask) who died suddenly in 2002.

 

Russel Harty and Kenneth Williams..

 

Montgomery Clift and James Dean..

 

Just a few examples...

And don't forget Michael Jackson.

[themaninblack 2,112]

Stephen Gately's recent tragic death and that of Matt Lucas' ex Kevin McGee has got me thinking.

Prominent homosexuals do seem to have shorter lifespans. Even if you disregard the obvious AIDS tragedies that

have happened over the years, many known (or indeed not so 'known') homosexuals have come a cropper somewhat early.

 

I'm thinking radio DJ Kevin Greening who bought the farm last Christmas.

BBC presenter Christopher Price (Christopher who? You ask) who died suddenly in 2002.

 

Russel Harty and Kenneth Williams..

 

Montgomery Clift and James Dean..

 

Just a few examples...

And don't forget Michael Jackson.

 

Allegedly....

 

Of course if we are talking Peter Pans of Pop, then a certain knight of the realm is still going strong at 69...

 

 

...allegedly!

[Ulitzer95 12,638]

Stephen Gately's recent tragic death and that of Matt Lucas' ex Kevin McGee has got me thinking.

Prominent homosexuals do seem to have shorter lifespans. Even if you disregard the obvious AIDS tragedies that

have happened over the years, many known (or indeed not so 'known') homosexuals have come a cropper somewhat early.

 

I'm thinking radio DJ Kevin Greening who bought the farm last Christmas.

BBC presenter Christopher Price (Christopher who? You ask) who died suddenly in 2002.

 

Russel Harty and Kenneth Williams..

 

Montgomery Clift and James Dean..

 

Just a few examples...

 

I think this is a bad idea for a thread. The first few names which you mentioned e.g. Kevin Greening would be better suited to a thread about people with drug habbits, whereas people like McGee rightfully belong in the suicidal thread which already exists.

 

Clift and Dean were both bisexual, not exclusively gay but Clift died from a freak heart attack relating to undiagnosed heart problems and Dean was speeding like a maniac. I don't think underlying heart conditions and speeding in a sports car is really relevant to their sexuality TBH, there's no real link. I would see the sense in creating a thread about HIV-positive folk on the other hand as I can think of loads of people who have the disease (albeit the AIDS crisis is over and sufferings live MUCH longer than before, much more is known about the disease plus general awareness is better) e.g. Magic Johnson, Andy Bell and Holly Johnson. They'll probably all live for decades yet though...

 

There's also the problem of whether people are infact gay.... e.g. Michael Jackson, Cliff Richard, Robbie Williams, Queen Latifah etc.

[Guest Justin Fashanu]

I think this is a bad idea for a thread. The first few names which you mentioned e.g. Kevin Greening would be better suited to a thread about people with drug habbits, whereas people like McGee rightfully belong in the suicidal thread which already exists.

 

Clift and Dean were both bisexual, not exclusively gay but Clift died from a freak heart attack relating to undiagnosed heart problems and Dean was speeding like a maniac. I don't think underlying heart conditions and speeding in a sports car is really relevant to their sexuality TBH, there's no real link. I would see the sense in creating a thread about HIV-positive folk on the other hand as I can think of loads of people who have the disease (albeit the AIDS crisis is over and sufferings live MUCH longer than before, much more is known about the disease plus general awareness is better) e.g. Magic Johnson, Andy Bell and Holly Johnson. They'll probably all live for decades yet though...

 

There's also the problem of whether people are infact gay.... e.g. Michael Jackson, Cliff Richard, Robbie Williams, Queen Latifah etc.

 

Hear, hear! There are no damn statistics to prove your drivel. You could equally come up with examples of tortured souls in the hetero world who've not lived to draw a pension.

 

Unless you can convince us otherwise move along, there's nothing to see here.

[Guest Guest]

I would see the sense in creating a thread about HIV-positive folk on the other hand as I can think of loads of people who have the disease (albeit the AIDS crisis is over and sufferings live MUCH longer than before, much more is known about the disease plus general awareness is better) e.g. Magic Johnson, Andy Bell and Holly Johnson.

 

http://www.deathlist.net/forums/index.php?...ost&p=36674

[themaninblack 2,112]

I think this is a bad idea for a thread. The first few names which you mentioned e.g. Kevin Greening would be better suited to a thread about people with drug habbits, whereas people like McGee rightfully belong in the suicidal thread which already exists.

 

Clift and Dean were both bisexual, not exclusively gay but Clift died from a freak heart attack relating to undiagnosed heart problems and Dean was speeding like a maniac. I don't think underlying heart conditions and speeding in a sports car is really relevant to their sexuality TBH, there's no real link. I would see the sense in creating a thread about HIV-positive folk on the other hand as I can think of loads of people who have the disease (albeit the AIDS crisis is over and sufferings live MUCH longer than before, much more is known about the disease plus general awareness is better) e.g. Magic Johnson, Andy Bell and Holly Johnson. They'll probably all live for decades yet though...

 

There's also the problem of whether people are infact gay.... e.g. Michael Jackson, Cliff Richard, Robbie Williams, Queen Latifah etc.

 

Hear, hear! There are no damn statistics to prove your drivel. You could equally come up with examples of tortured souls in the hetero world who've not lived to draw a pension.

 

Unless you can convince us otherwise move along, there's nothing to see here.

 

Just a bit of idle speculation Justin, nothing to get your football shorts in a twist about. Mind you weren't exactly the best example of a long life, were you?

[Guest Dale Winton]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

[themaninblack 2,112]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

[Guest Dale Winton]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

 

John Gielgud...William Burroughs...Sir Arthur C. Clarke...Edward Heath...

[themaninblack 2,112]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

 

John Gielgud...William Burroughs...Sir Arthur C. Clarke...Edward Heath...

 

Joe Meek...

[Guest Dale Winton]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

 

John Gielgud...William Burroughs...Sir Arthur C. Clarke...Edward Heath...

 

Joe Meek...

 

There's nowt so queer as folk.

 

Aaron Copland...E.M. Forster....Gian Carlo Menotti

[Windsor 2,233]

According to the rantings of the local evangelical minister in Fraserburgh, homosexuals are more likely to commit suicide due to loneliness. He wasn't too impressed when I told him that we were perhaps more likely to turn to suicide due to people like him.

 

I think I have already spoken of this man.

[honez 79]

Not to mention Alan Turing.

 

 

 

Damn, I mentioned him.

 

 

And Jimmy the Pill's friend, Sir James S.

And, at the risk of raising SC's ire, a certain monocled Astronomer perhaps?

[themaninblack 2,112]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

 

John Gielgud...William Burroughs...Sir Arthur C. Clarke...Edward Heath...

 

Joe Meek...

 

There's nowt so queer as folk.

 

Aaron Copland...E.M. Forster....Gian Carlo Menotti

 

Billy MacKenzie, Joe Orton, Brian Epstien...

[Terminator 13]

Quentin Crisp reached his 90s and Edwin Morgan will be 90 next year.

 

Now your talking.

 

If it's bullshit, say so, with the appropriate evidence.

 

I'll raise you Oscar Wilde...

 

John Gielgud...William Burroughs...Sir Arthur C. Clarke...Edward Heath...

 

Joe Meek...

 

There's nowt so queer as folk.

 

Aaron Copland...E.M. Forster....Gian Carlo Menotti

 

Billy MacKenzie, Joe Orton, Brian Epstien...

Well done for your enlightening list....I bet there are a load of other famous (and only known to you) gays on the "tip of your tongue". Go on....spit them out....

[Ulitzer95 12,638]

*Peggy Gilbert, a jazz musician lived to 102.

*Ruth Ellis, an early gay rights activist lived to 101.

*Harry Hay, another early gay rights activist lived to 90. His partner John Burnside, the inventor of the teleidoscope, died last year at 91.

*Sir John Gielgud lived to a very reasonable 96, as did Virginia Prince.

*Gian Carlo Menotti was 95.

*Sir Michael Tippett was 93.

*Quentin Crisp was 90.

*Kurt von Ruffin roughed it out for 95 years despite being kept in a concentration camp for sometime. Fellow inmate Karl Gorath lived to a ripe 90.

*Moody bisexual and Hitler's favourite, Marlene Dietrich clocked it up to 90.

*Berenice Abbott was 93.

*Aaron Copland was another composer to see 90.

*Virgil Thomson, a composer of 92.

*Duncan Grant was 93.

*E. M. Forster was 91.

*W. Somerset Maugham, also 91.

*King Gustav V of Sweden was 92.

*Pharaoh Pepi II of Neferkare was roughly about 94.

*Kermit Love, sadly passed away last year but he was 91.

*James Kirkup passed away in May, aged 91.

*Harold Norse passed away in June, aged 92.

*Merce Cunningham passed away in July, aged 90.

 

I'll stop there for the ones that are already dead because if I start going into names of individuals that lived into their 80s I'll be here all day.

 

OK, since this thread is growing... may as well concentrate on some possibilities for 2010!

 

*Hugues Cuenod is still alive. He is 108 next year. His husband (or civil partner to be precise) is 41 years younger than him. F**k me! Although that might be what's keeping him feeling so young!

*British Army commando and journalist Micky Burn will be 98!

*Gay rights activist Axel Axgil is 95 next year!

*Nazi victims Karl Lange and Paul Gerhard Vogel will also turn 95!

*Playwright Arthur Laurents will turn 92.

*Singer Chavela Vargas will turn 91.

*Pierre Cardin, already on the main list, is 88 next year.

*Drag queen/WWII veteran Jose Sarria will be 87 or 88.

*Composer Ned Rorem will be 87, as will Fred Richmond and director Franco Zeffirelli.

*Phyllis Lyon, a very prominent gay rights activist in the U.S. will be 86 next year, as will poet Edward Field.

*The great Gore Vidal, gay rights activist Frank Kameny and singer Johnny Brandon will be 85.

*Ronnie Gilbert, of The Weavers and a collaborator with Pete Seeger, will be 84 next year, as will composers Lee Hoiby and Hanz Werner Henze, minister Otis Charles and Lord Edward Douglas-Scott-Montagu, known for his "bisexual activities".

*Underground filmmaker Kenneth Anger and poet John Ashbery will be 83.

*Composer Ruth Anderson, actor Jack Larson, legendary filmmaker James Ivory, gay rights activist John Challis, Labour Party politician Maureen Colquhoun, philanthropist Joan Chalmers and playwright Edward Albee will all turn 82 in 2010.

*Cecil Taylor, novelist Dominique Fernandez, sex educator Betty Dodson, Canadian politician Laurier LaPierre and ufologist Ted Bloecher will turn 81.

*Rabbi Lionel Blue will turn 80.

*At a push, Tab Hunter will be 79 next year and Giorgio Armani will be 76, as will Sir Peter Maxwell Davies and Rip Taylor. Johnny Mathis and Larry Kramer will be a reasonable 75.

 

That's all I could find at the moment. I really don't think there are that many. Coming out wasn't really a normal thing to do until later in the 80s.. maybe even the 90s and in many places it's seen as taboo and not socially right so I think it's fair to say that a great deal of older celebs out there will be discretely gay or bisexual without us knowing about it. We also have to consider the fact that a lot of them will never come to terms with their sexuality and a lot of people didn't get to become famous BECAUSE of it and therefore didn't get the roles in Hollywood etc. because of it. All these factors produce a shorter list.

[Death Impends 7,977]

*Kurt von Ruffin roughed it out for 95 years despite being kept in a concentration camp for sometime. Fellow inmate Karl Gorath lived to a ripe 90.

 

In that vein are Paul Gerhard Vogel and Karl Lange, both of whom appear to be living.

[Ulitzer95 12,638]

*Kurt von Ruffin roughed it out for 95 years despite being kept in a concentration camp for sometime. Fellow inmate Karl Gorath lived to a ripe 90.

 

In that vein are Paul Gerhard Vogel and Karl Lange, both of whom appear to be living.

Added. Thanks!

[Canadian Paul 97]

*Kurt von Ruffin roughed it out for 95 years despite being kept in a concentration camp for sometime. Fellow inmate Karl Gorath lived to a ripe 90.

 

In that vein are Paul Gerhard Vogel and Karl Lange, both of whom appear to be living.

Added. Thanks!

 

I'm not taking sides in this debate but, since we're on this vein, another Nazi victim Friedrich-Paul von Groszheim lived until at least 89, possibly 97 and could even still be living.

[Lard Bazaar 3,799]

Robbie Williams is not gay, and I'll fight any bitch that says he is!

[time 8,606]

Robbie Williams is not gay, and I'll fight any bitch that says he is!

 

He's not but his boyfriend is...

[Lard Bazaar 3,799]

Robbie Williams is not gay, and I'll fight any bitch that says he is!

 

He's not but his boyfriend is...

 

Let's take this outside, shall we?

[Handrejka 1,904]

Stephen Gately's recent tragic death and that of Matt Lucas' ex Kevin McGee has got me thinking.

Prominent homosexuals do seem to have shorter lifespans. Even if you disregard the obvious AIDS tragedies that

have happened over the years, many known (or indeed not so 'known') homosexuals have come a cropper somewhat early.

 

I'm thinking radio DJ Kevin Greening who bought the farm last Christmas.

BBC presenter Christopher Price (Christopher who? You ask) who died suddenly in 2002.

 

Russel Harty and Kenneth Williams..

 

Montgomery Clift and James Dean..

 

Just a few examples...

 

 

Kenneth's Williams comedy partner Hugh Paddick who was also gay lived until he was 85, and Kenneth Horne who was straigh died at the same age as Kenneth Williams. I think people see the patterns they want to see.

 

BTW - any else think George Clooney is gay?

[Godot 149]

Interesting debate but what's so great about gays (queers, lesies, cock bandits, arse bandits, faggots, homos, fudgepackers, botty boys, poofs, ponces, dykes, fairies) that they should get their own thread? Not sure there should be a pink thread that works like a gay box for all things gay. What about other minorities?

 

Should we also have a unidexter thread for unidexters who may be reaching the end game? A black thread for black people (or should that be Afro Caribbean or is that too PC for some?) A Paki thread? A Chinky thread? One for wops, spics, kikes, Micks, left footers, convicts, Tykes, scousers, barrow boys, geeks, round eyes, slant eyes, trailer trash, Sloanies, Ras, toffs, aristos, rednecks, honkies, nips, yellow bellies, dagos, waps, frogs, huns, towel heads, skinheads, Polaks, retards, fatties, stick insects, short arses, MPs, gimmers, pedos, pervs, picaninies, Jesus freaks, munchkins (whoops!), veggies, commies, pinkos, fascists, spades, wimmin, Telegraph readers, Banshees Scream, ghouls (surely not here) and so on and so on.

 

 

Or just the gay ones?

 

 

As a Yorkshireman (Tyke, Yorkshire git, northern git [twat etc. etc]) I have long been frustrated by the appropriation of the word "queer" as it was always used in my family to mean "odd", as in "Nowt so queer as folk." Then it became a derogatory term for gays and now I understand gays (etc, etc) have "reclaimed" the word. Why can't Yorkshire folk (gits, twats etc) reclaim it?

 

Apologies for anyone who does not feel they are covered by any of the above categories. Oh and apologies also to Lenny Bruce.