The EU Referendum Hokey Cokey

[the_engineer 1,415]

Just go for no deal. The 35/39 billion that was going to be paid to the EU can be used to fund any gap. Fuck the EU they're treating the UK like shit with no respect. The fact they want all remainers to suffer should tell remainers how much the EU cares.The UK Need closer relations to russia,hungary( hopefully hungary leaves the EU too) and fund brexit movements in other european nations. Try to convince italy to dump the Euro aswell. Lets be honest here corbyn is secretly pro brexit as he knows the EU is not looking out for poor /working class peoples best interests. The EU laws prevent nationalising water for example. The EU also stops the UK from fulfilling is capitalist potential and adding common sense back into our laws.This is from the right with people like jacob rees mogg. The poor and the rich, the capitalist and the socialist can't put in practice laws that will make a real difference to the British people as its impossible with the cards dealt by the EU . The EU is power without limits and you're seeing what happens when the EU's power is questioned. 

 

 

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

1 hour ago, gcreptile said:

The EU is looking for a deal that involves a clear cut, but with as minimal pain for both sides as possible.

Theresa May wants a deal in which the UK still keeps all the benefits of EU membership.

In the end, she doesn't want that clear cut that the EU has accepted will happen.

 

In a way, the EU understands the Brexiteers better than May, because the Brexiteers wanted to leave, and so they will leave. But maybe the real matter is that many of the Brexit voters were promised that the "all benefits, no costs" deal was possible. They were told that a clear cut was possible without any losses. They were lied to and so the referendum is not a true reflection of the will of the people. 

Wrong.

Do you really think we voted to leave to cut some sort of preferential deal afterwards?

Fucking hell.

 

 

[charon 4,943]

GC mistakes a Referendum for an Election.

 

Big difference.

 

They get elected to be able to carry out the common goal, not to try and change it.

 

They were telt to leave the EU, get on with it.

 

Fuck the consequences, get out of the Forth Reich was the call so do it.

 

 

* heard one wee whiny bitch, aged 16, " but its my future, 50 years to sort is my entire Life".

 

Well sweetcheeks tough fucking shitola, its my entire Life too.

 

* and I'm not going to go to Uni, work for two years, become a baby factory and not pay any tax the rest of your entire Life whilst whing about house prices.

 

Young folk are criminally stupid these days, and its my generation that's at fault.

 

Thank fuck I never bred any of the fucktards.

 

[gcreptile 11,078]

45 minutes ago, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Wrong.

Do you really think we voted to leave to cut some sort of preferential deal afterwards?

Fucking hell.

 

 

Yes, the engineer said this:

1 hour ago, the_engineer said:

The fact they want all remainers to suffer should tell remainers how much the EU cares.

If the UK post-Brexit would be an economic paradise, the remainers obviously wouldn't suffer then. But he says that the Remainers suffer because there is no deal.

 

Apparently, the economic promises of Brexit only work with a bit of cherry-picking. I believe a lot of "professional" brexiteers thought they could get some more concessions with their "Don't make me leave you or I'll kill myself" strategy.

[gcreptile 11,078]

26 minutes ago, charon said:

They were telt to leave the EU, get on with it.

 

Fuck the consequences, get out of the Forth Reich was the call so do it.

 

 

I actually agree with you. A no-deal Brexit is the "cleanest" way. But as I just said above, many of the professional brexiteers didn't want that.

[charon 4,943]

They might not want it, but it'll be the case.

 

 

What a lot of folk don't 'get' is a hard brexit will see the tumbling domino effect.

 

Plenty of other countries wavering, so the UK wid be in the best place as it unzips.

 

Then the UK unzips.

 

 

Winner.

 

 

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

5 minutes ago, gcreptile said:

Yes, the engineer said this:

If the UK post-Brexit would be an economic paradise, the remainers obviously wouldn't suffer then. But he says that the Remainers suffer because there is no deal.

 

Apparently, the economic promises of Brexit only work with a bit of cherry-picking. I believe a lot of "professional" brexiteers thought they could get some more concessions with their "Don't make me leave you or I'll kill myself" strategy.

Unsurprisingly, you miss the point.

Part and parcel of our useless Government  trying to negotiate a deal is purely to appease those that voted to remain and businesses that assume the world is going to cave in when we do so.

The point about the EU making remainers suffer pertains to the belief that their most ardent supporters in the UK are being sidelined by the EU leadership.

Brexiteers did not want a deal so don't give a shit if there isn't one.

Who the fuck are 'professional' brexiteers? Do you actually have a fucking clue who voted to leave?

You may as well be talking about professional remainers who told everybody that our economy would collapse immediately if we voted to leave.

Our Government is an embarrassment, useless, inept and dire, however, the EU hierarchy are equally as repulsive.

It is what it is but don't confuse the negotiations with public opinion, they are separate, moreover try not to venture opinions on how we think or feel about it when you have no real idea whatsoever.

 

 

 

 

[gcreptile 11,078]

17 minutes ago, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Who the fuck are 'professional' brexiteers? Do you actually have a fucking clue who voted to leave?

With "professional brexiteers" I mean those who paid for it:

https://www.businessinsider.de/sunday-times-rich-list-2017-biggest-political-donors-to-the-brexit-campaign-2017-4?_ga=2.4699315.1614299354.1537552810-854250911.1537301399&r=UK&IR=T

 

- those who used it for their careers, like Boris Johnson who then quit to avoid having to deal with this mess, or Nigel Farage, who doesn't even intend to live in Brexited UK.

Also those who sell newspapers with pro-Brexit headlines (owners of the Daily Mail/Telegraph/Express).

 

I think, they thought that the UK could make a deal that would keep access to the EU markets (and vice versa) but without the EU rules on financial regulation, transparency, consumer rights and social safety nets.

 

I do not mean the people who were misled that Brexit would be achievable without any loss in welfare. I respect those who want Brexit and want to pay the price for it, a weakened pound, falling housing values, losing Scotland, and the like...

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

25 minutes ago, gcreptile said:

With "professional brexiteers" I mean those who paid for it:

https://www.businessinsider.de/sunday-times-rich-list-2017-biggest-political-donors-to-the-brexit-campaign-2017-4?_ga=2.4699315.1614299354.1537552810-854250911.1537301399&r=UK&IR=T

 

- those who used it for their careers, like Boris Johnson who then quit to avoid having to deal with this mess, or Nigel Farage, who doesn't even intend to live in Brexited UK.

Also those who sell newspapers with pro-Brexit headlines (owners of the Daily Mail/Telegraph/Express).

 

I think, they thought that the UK could make a deal that would keep access to the EU markets (and vice versa) but without the EU rules on financial regulation, transparency, consumer rights and social safety nets.

 

I do not mean the people who were misled that Brexit would be achievable without any loss in welfare. I respect those who want Brexit and want to pay the price for it, a weakened pound, falling housing values, losing Scotland, and the like...

For balance  https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-referendum-donations-ten-wealthy-political-donors-make-up-half-vote-leave-remain-nigel-a7348321.html

It was not all a one way street and you obviously do not get how Political funding works in the UK because, if you did, the bullshit article you are holding up to demonstrate how some mega rich billionaires hijacked the referendum and hoodwinked all of those poor saps into voting leave would have been left where it was and not used to demonstrate nothing at all.

I won't bother mentioning the press and their allegiances or that most of us think Boris is a complete dick and he will NEVER lead his party let alone his country.

Then again, what the fuck would you really know about it?

Both sides were heavily funded and funded by people who had a vested interest in the result. So what? Business funds the Tories, the Unions fund Labour, that is the general way things work here but, amazingly, we are free thinking enough to vote the way WE want to vote anyway.

Did you forget that the polls prior to the result showed the UK as staying in the EU?

What you think is wrong, you think on the basis that the UK is beholden to the EU, it is not, no more than the EU is to the UK. Two way traffic.

I can give you plenty of examples of the counter argument, people who believe leaving will be good but what's the point? You are German, you live in Europe and your country runs Europe in a way Hitler could only have dreamed about.

Oh, if only we had known, over a century just how Europe would end up. Would we have wasted such young lives in going out there to die so that future European generations would have the freedoms to live how they want to, say what they want to and choose who they would want to lead them? Maybe not. They died in vain, so pointless.

That does seem harsh but, at this moment, I am royally fucked off to read utter shite from somebody who has not a sodding clue just what millions of us would and HAVE sacrificed in order to have the right to choose the way we would like to live.

Next you will be telling me about how Ireland will be unified by the result.

 

[msc 18,543]

Those posts are too long. I think Reptile and Lord are actually agreeing with lots and lots of words?

 

Did someone say something about house prices being a stupid economic measure? I think they did. I agree with them.

 

All of these politicians are shite. I'd rather Tony Benn as he is now than any of them. Yeah, Zombie Benn the mad Brexiteer, still more common sense than the rest of them.

 

As you were...

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

6 minutes ago, msc said:

Those posts are too long. I think Reptile and Lord are actually agreeing with lots and lots of words?

 

Did someone say something about house prices being a stupid economic measure? I think they did. I agree with them.

 

All of these politicians are shite. I'd rather Tony Benn as he is now than any of them. Yeah, Zombie Benn the mad Brexiteer, still more common sense than the rest of them.

 

As you were...

I agree.

My piss has been boiled, that's my only excuse.

[msc 18,543]

What you do with your piss is up to you!

[charon 4,943]

Losing Scotland........

 

 

That's the fucking Plus.

 

 

Holeeee fuckity.

 

 

Download AIS and watch the Euro trawlers gang up off Orkney whilst the Brit official boat sits off and stops Scots boats.

 

Constantly.

 

 

Fuck the EU, fuck the UK and fuck Democracy.

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

17 minutes ago, charon said:

Losing Scotland........

 

 

That's the fucking Plus.

 

 

Holeeee fuckity.

 

 

Download AIS and watch the Euro trawlers gang up off Orkney whilst the Brit official boat sits off and stops Scots boats.

 

Constantly.

 

 

Fuck the EU, fuck the UK and fuck Democracy.

Obviously, when we are not in the EU, the Brit boat will become a frigate and blow those fuckers out of the water.

This will then allow Jock boats free reign to catch whatever they want.

[gcreptile 11,078]

57 minutes ago, msc said:

Those posts are too long. I think Reptile and Lord are actually agreeing with lots and lots of words?

Yes, I think we do. He wants Brexit, I say, go for it! We also agree that both sides were funded by special interest groups and the billionaires vs unions separation shows what it's about. 

And yes, I am even tempted to mention Northern Ireland, I wonder what they do when they will be surrounded by the EU by around 2025.

 

However, I do think that the German influence is overrated and Merkel is a big failure. Look what happened on her "watch": Brexit, Russia invades Ukraine, 3/4rd of Europe lurching to the right because of HER policies. I think she's the worst thing that happened to Europe since...I don't know... Hitler? Or let's not exaggerate... Milosevic. She was lucky to be in power when the crash came which Germany weathered well because of the reforms her predecessor enacted. She reaped all the benefits. All the big developments of our time have been moving against her intentions. And she used that good standing during the crisis to punish other countries and make Germany extremely unpopular throughout Europe.

[charon 4,943]

Hmmmm.

 

A unified Europe under one currency and basically one army, with a Berlin ruler.

 

Aye, Hitler wid be disappointed.

[philheybrookbay 439]

11 hours ago, charon said:

They might not want it, but it'll be the case.

 

 

What a lot of folk don't 'get' is a hard brexit will see the tumbling domino effect.

 

Plenty of other countries wavering, so the UK wid be in the best place as it unzips.

 

Then the UK unzips.

 

 

Winner.

 

 

Agree.

 

Lets face it, it’s Germany/France worst nightmare to see the EU other member states leave. So let’s make it nigh on bloody impossible to put others (Greece/Italy/Hungry) off even thinking about leaving. 

 

Of of course it doesn’t help we’ve got this mess of a Government at Westminster at the moment. Little cohesion equals chaos.

 

Let’s just go for No deal now. As much as the EU says we need them, the reverse is true.  

 

Like all divorces it’ll be rough for a year or so after, but then? 

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

I hate this thread, it infuriates me and makes me post long tirades and life really is too short for all that.

Lets summarise things.

This country has survived invasions, wars, poverty, disease, tyranny, democracy and everything else that has been thrown at it since it became a small Island in the channel.

Through all of that we are the 5th ( or thereabouts) most powerful economy on the planet, we are socially and culturally diverse with a rich history most of the World envies. We have FREE healthcare, education and a welfare system that cannot really be bettered.

Yes, it is not perfect, we moan about all of the above but, fucking hell, when you sit down and think about it, it's brilliant really.

We have unions to protect the rights of workers ( I'm 30 odd years fully paid up) and we have business people and entrepreneurs that create jobs and create wealth, not always for the good from all ends but, again, it's not too shabby, is it.

We are a nation built on migration, few of us cannot trace back at least one of our ancestors to other countries.

We have nearly 4 million Europeans living in the UK, countless more from outside Europe living here too.

We have a migrant crisis at the ports of France because they want to come here and we have enough French citizens living here to create the 6th biggest city in France.

We cannot be that bad a place to be then, can we!!!

We are industrious, hardworking, inventive and clever. We do satire and humour like no other nation or culture and we do drama as good as the best.

We have football that is played in the most exciting to watch league in the World, we endeavour to be honest and show the greatest of integrity in all of the sport we play. We are seen as decent, honest and fair.

Our judicial system has been copied and mirrored throughout the World because it is seen to be fair and true, not perfect but what is?

We have punched above our weight for centuries because we are British.

In view of all of that, why the fucking hell are we that bothered about the balls up that is leaving the EU?

Fuck em all.

( sorry MSC, my last long post....     )

 

 

 

[paddyfool 379]

Eh, we're bothered about it because it's obviously detrimental to us and not in our country's best interests (or our neighbours' best interests either, tbh).  

 

Meanwhile, does anyone else feel it's a bit much of May to demand respect from the EU when she doesn't comnand much of it from her own party or country?

[Cat O'Falk 3,290]

On 21/09/2018 at 19:56, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Next you will be telling me about how Ireland will be unified by the result.

 

A hard border follows, terrorism rears it's ugly head again and unification happens in 2024. 

[philheybrookbay 439]

Oh brilliant. Andrew Marr has mentioned the words General Election........

 

Now it’s 83% Labour supporters want a second referendum. In London perhaps but not here.

 

This is Millennials at work. The generation that got prizes for coming last in sports day and praised for failing. Now look where we are. Didn’t like the result let’s have another vote until we get what we want.

 

Lets have the election to confuse the matter completely with less than 6 months to go. You couldn’t make it up

 

 

[msc 18,543]

Just saying, if we millennials got prizes for coming last on sports day, I'd have had more gold than Usain Bolt. Either folk are exaggerating things ever so slightly, or a Scottish education is vastly superior to a non-Scottish one...

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,226]

1 minute ago, msc said:

Just saying, if we millennials got prizes for coming last on sports day, I'd have had more gold than Usain Bolt. Either folk are exaggerating things ever so slightly, or a Scottish education is vastly superior to a non-Scottish one...

Yes but Scotchland is another country innit, different rules.

It is more of a generalisation but, yes, it is true that various schools around the UK did decide that sports and games where you won or lost should be scrapped for pastimes where nobody had to suffer the heartache of defeat.

IIRC, this happened more in London, obviously.

 

[msc 18,543]

19 minutes ago, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Yes but Scotchland is another country innit, different rules.

It is more of a generalisation but, yes, it is true that various schools around the UK did decide that sports and games where you won or lost should be scrapped for pastimes where nobody had to suffer the heartache of defeat.

IIRC, this happened more in London, obviously.

 

 

Ah, well, London, innit?

 

As Rab C one put it, London's "aright for a fracture but I wouldnae like to be terminal with it."

 

[paddyfool 379]

The country as a whole are apparently split 50:50 on the question of whether there should be a second ref or not: https://whatukthinks.org/eu/questions/do-you-think-there-should-be-a-second-referendum-to-accept-or-reject-the-terms-of-britains-exit-from-the-eu-once-they-have-been-agreed/

 

Millenials obviously make up much less than half the adult population, and are not going to be unanimous, so it can't just be down to them.

 

Meanwhile, which way people would vote if there was a second ref would be very much in doubt, as the polls remain very near 50:50 on this question as well, albeit with a narrow and very slowly growing lead for Remain (see the top four links here: https://whatukthinks.org/eu/opinion-polls/uk-poll-results/).  There's not much shifting among people who voted either way last time; mainly the shift is in people who didn't vote saying that this time, they'd go to the polls and vote Remain, and demographic shift, with new young voters mainly wanting to Remain. It would be interesting to see how this turns out...