dead Peter Sutcliffe

[gcreptile 10,969]

"Was it right to give him a Guardian obituary?"

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/23/guardian-obituary-peter-sutcliffe

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,218]

12 minutes ago, gcreptile said:

"Was it right to give him a Guardian obituary?"

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/23/guardian-obituary-peter-sutcliffe

Obituaries are merely reports of deaths fleshed out with any relevant details of their life.

They are not celebrations of a life or meant to salute or pay respects to the people who have died, they are just reports and background detail of a death.

The death of Sutcliffe was newsworthy and the obituary reported it, with historical background, as his death was significant.

That is all.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

14 minutes ago, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Obituaries are merely reports of deaths fleshed out with any relevant details of their life.

They are not celebrations of a life or meant to salute or pay respects to the people who have died, they are just reports and background detail of a death.

The death of Sutcliffe was newsworthy and the obituary reported it, with historical background, as his death was significant.

That is all.

 

 

Aye, a fair point - and The Guardian and Telegraph in particular like to pick up people who - however indirectly - made a small difference to history. In Sutcliffe's case his continued freedom from the arrival of John Humble's tape to 2 Jan 1981 ensured policing with regard to major murder cases would never be the same again.

[Lord Fellatio Nelson 6,218]

2 minutes ago, maryportfuncity said:

 

 

Aye, a fair point - and The Guardian and Telegraph in particular like to pick up people who - however indirectly - made a small difference to history. In Sutcliffe's case his continued freedom from the arrival of John Humble's tape to 2 Jan 1981 ensured policing with regard to major murder cases would never be the same again.

Yes, you are spot on.

Those of us of a certain age will remember the moment that tape was played and how, well, eerie it all felt.

What a complete balls up it turned out to be!

[The Old Crem 3,583]

16 hours ago, gcreptile said:

"Was it right to give him a Guardian obituary?"

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/23/guardian-obituary-peter-sutcliffe

Interesting that she mentions no further serial killer obituaries have been prepared for in advance.

[Slackhurst Broadcasting 374]

When Rose West goes I'm sure the Guardian will find someone to tell us what a victim she was.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

Mirror's inside track on Sutcliffe's send off suggests Sonia Szurma-Sutcliffe shut out his siblings and also mentions brother Mick is seriously ill. Just finished re-reading "Somebody's Husband, Somebody's Son" which is a portrait of Bingley life and the Sutcliffe clan in all their ramshackle glory. The habits of Pete's pisshead brothers get some attention*. Mick will doubtless get a mention or two in the press on expiry!

 

 

 

* The last paragraph in the book being an absolute gem of a scene. Carl Sutcliffe (younger brother of Pete) visits the shabby waxwork museum on Morecambe pier his big brother loved. He recalls the time spent there in the past and goes to the room of Victorian exhibits including waxworks of the advanced stages of VD and anatomical studies of uterine conditions. These amount to part of the chamber of horrors at the place but Carl is amazed to see they've also added a waxwork of Peter Sutcliffe. He's also affronted that because they've stuck Peter's head on an existing body they've got his size and build wrong. He has this out with the manager who looks Carl up and down - clocks the denim jacket which is plastered with metal golliwogs (because Carl collected the tokens from marmalade jars) and a Ban the Bomb badge - and can't figure out if this guy claiming to be the affronted brother of the real ripper is the genuine article.

[Toast 16,137]

23 minutes ago, maryportfuncity said:

 metal golliwogs (because Carl collected the tokens from marmalade jars)

 

Robertson's jam.  There was a big range of golliwog badges with the gollies engaged in various activities.  (You could also get little models, but they required extra tokens.)

I hated golliwogs.  I thought they were hideous and they frightened me.  It was my mum who was keen on these, and who sent off for an ice-skating golly badge for me. 

I never associated gollies with humans at all, so there was no racism there.  I saw them as another species, like elves or gnomes. 

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

1 hour ago, Toast said:

 

Robertson's jam.  There was a big range of golliwog badges with the gollies engaged in various activities.  (You could also get little models, but they required extra tokens.)

I hated golliwogs.  I thought they were hideous and they frightened me.  It was my mum who was keen on these, and who sent off for an ice-skating golly badge for me. 

I never associated gollies with humans at all, so there was no racism there.  I saw them as another species, like elves or gnomes. 

 

 

Aye, so they were on "preserve" jars - marmalade and jam. My bad, then. Maybe the Ripper's l'al brother was a jam eater (in the unlikely event any other Cumbrians are looking in, that's actually an amusing thought to do with a local joke!)

 

 

[Toast 16,137]

You're not wrong, they made Golden Shred marmalade as well as jam.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

1 minute ago, Toast said:

You're not wrong, they made Golden Shred marmalade as well as jam.

 

 

Yeah, I recall seeing an episode of Love thy Neighbour once in which Jack Smethurst told Rudolph Walker to "get back on the marmalade jar" - strangely, a series that's not enjoyed prime time repeats on the main ITV channels in decades

[Toast 16,137]

I associate it more with jam because there was a lad at my primary school named Robertson and people called him Jammy.

[Charlotte's Controller 195]

The Ripper a new Netflix production

[Deathrace 1,170]

6 hours ago, Charlotte's Controller said:

The Ripper a new Netflix production

And?

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

1 hour ago, Deathrace said:

And?

 

 

Predictably some of the surviving family members of his victims have already gone public with the way they feel misled and are less than impressed. The original title - for example - didn't include the word Ripper.

[Dying Probably 578]

I'd like to give everyone a nice morning by reminding you that this fucker is dead!

[Deathrace 1,170]

On 23/11/2020 at 20:15, Lord Fellatio Nelson said:

Yes, you are spot on.

Those of us of a certain age will remember the moment that tape was played and how, well, eerie it all felt.

What a complete balls up it turned out to be!

It's a painful irony that George Oldfield described the tape as being the work of a great criminal mind when in actual fact it was the work of a bloke pissed out of his brains playing a tragic practical joke. Plus Sutcliffe was described as being some malevolent superhuman when in fact he was a totally inadequate nonentity. 

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

1 hour ago, Deathrace said:

It's a painful irony that George Oldfield described the tape as being the work of a great criminal mind when in actual fact it was the work of a bloke pissed out of his brains playing a tragic practical joke. Plus Sutcliffe was described as being some malevolent superhuman when in fact he was a totally inadequate nonentity. 

 

 

Bit harsh on his estimable skills handling a lorry, but I get your point

[Slackhurst Broadcasting 374]

I suppose the hoaxer got away with it longer than Sutcliffe did.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

[Deathrace 1,170]

Has anyone watched the current ITV series, "The Long Shadow"? It's a very good dramatisation of such a tragic story which focuses on the victims, their families and the police rather than the murderer. 

 

It feels very bad taste to mention it but there's only a few of those represented prominently in the drama who I believe are still alive. They include Jim Hobson (one of the main police inspectors), Marcella Claxton (one of the surviving victims) and Doreen Hill (mother of the final victim). I hope the last two in particular have found some peace in their later years. 

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

9 hours ago, Deathrace said:

Has anyone watched the current ITV series, "The Long Shadow"? It's a very good dramatisation of such a tragic story which focuses on the victims, their families and the police rather than the murderer. 

 

It feels very bad taste to mention it but there's only a few of those represented prominently in the drama who I believe are still alive. They include Jim Hobson (one of the main police inspectors), Marcella Claxton (one of the surviving victims) and Doreen Hill (mother of the final victim). I hope the last two in particular have found some peace in their later years. 

 

 

Aye, thought it excellent and very good on period detail (cars, the way people dealt with each other and in particular how women were treated). 

 

Re obitable types from that time still around the obvious big name is Sonia - Ex-wife of Peter - Sutcliffe, now Mrs Woodward: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonia_Sutcliffe

[GrumpyRabbit 52]

2 hours ago, maryportfuncity said:

 

 

Aye, thought it excellent and very good on period detail (cars, the way people dealt with each other and in particular how women were treated). 

 

Re obitable types from that time still around the obvious big name is Sonia - Ex-wife of Peter - Sutcliffe, now Mrs Woodward: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonia_Sutcliffe

I watched the first episode last night and thought it looked very promising.  The book it’s based on is very good too “Wicked Beyond Belief”.  Looking forward to the rest of it.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

21 hours ago, GrumpyRabbit said:

I watched the first episode last night and thought it looked very promising.  The book it’s based on is very good too “Wicked Beyond Belief”.  Looking forward to the rest of it.

 

 

Best book I read on Sutcliffe is Gordon Burn's deep dive into the community and the family around the man, chilling if only because Sutcliffe clearly presented to so many of them as a bit eccentric but no dafter than a few other local odd types. As is often quoted - "the banality of evil" - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Somebodys-Husband-Son-Yorkshire-Ripper-ebook/dp/B005CG8HZM/ref=sr_1_1?crid=V9Y66RY4ITGL&keywords=somebody's+husband+somebody's+son&qid=1697959736&s=books&sprefix=somebody's+husband%2C+some%2Cstripbooks%2C55&sr=1-1

[Deathrace 1,170]

2 hours ago, maryportfuncity said:

 

 

Best book I read on Sutcliffe is Gordon Burn's deep dive into the community and the family around the man, chilling if only because Sutcliffe clearly presented to so many of them as a bit eccentric but no dafter than a few other local odd types. As is often quoted - "the banality of evil" - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Somebodys-Husband-Son-Yorkshire-Ripper-ebook/dp/B005CG8HZM/ref=sr_1_1?crid=V9Y66RY4ITGL&keywords=somebody's+husband+somebody's+son&qid=1697959736&s=books&sprefix=somebody's+husband%2C+some%2Cstripbooks%2C55&sr=1-1

Sutcliffe probably gives us a pretty good guide to the identity of Jack the Ripper who was probably someone equally outwardly insignificant. Most serial killers are.