Aristocrats

[dimreaper 697]

6 hours ago, Toast said:

I thought it had been common knowledge for some time.  The article is nearly two years old.

 

The theories as to his absence from public life have been mixed. He had become 'persona non grata' in aristocratic/royal circles upon his return to the U.K. in 2011 after running off to the Caribbean with a mistress. Some have interpreted his absence to be the result of being shunned. As his family has issued no official statement on his health, there is hardly any print sources that disclose the state of his health.

[YoungWillz 21,037]

On 14/09/2024 at 09:36, YoungWillz said:

Marquesses:

 

Granville Gordon, 13th Marquess of Huntly (b. 1944)

David Douglas, 12th Marquess of Queensberry (b. 1929)

Michael Ancram, 13th Marquess of Lothian (b. 1945)

Charles Petty-Fitzmaurice, 9th Marquess of Lansdowne (b. 1941)

Charles Townshend, 8th Marquess Townshend (b. 1945)

John Tottenham, 9th Marquess of Ely (b.1943)

Michael Cecil, 8th Marquess of Exeter (b. 1935)

David Pratt, 6th Marquess Camden (b. 1930)

Mark Dundas, 4th Marquess of Zetland (b. 1937)

Simon Isaacs, 4th Marquess of Reading (b. 1942)

Former Tory MP and Marquess of Lothian Michael Ancram Telegraph Obit: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2024/10/01/michael-ancram-conservative-northern-ireland-ira-peace/

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

22 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

Former Tory MP and Marquess of Lothian Michael Ancram Telegraph Obit: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2024/10/01/michael-ancram-conservative-northern-ireland-ira-peace/

Shocked by this but then he was always a big guy.

Ancram's death means that there is only one living person who was Deputy Conservative Leader. That's Peter Lilley who turned 81 in August. The party abolished the position in 2005 and have never restored it.

Interestingly Ancram had 3 kids but they were all daughters, so his younger brother now becomes the 14th Marquess of Lothian.

[prussianblue 1,027]

22 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

Former Tory MP and Marquess of Lothian Michael Ancram Telegraph Obit: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2024/10/01/michael-ancram-conservative-northern-ireland-ira-peace/

 

As he only had daughters, his successor is his younger brother Lord Ralph Kerr (b. 1957).

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

Ancram was also the only sitting Marquess in the House of Lords. 

The Marquess of Salisbury (wiki) resigned in 2017, and to my knowledge is doing fine. He turned 78 yesterday.

[Summer in Transylvania 2,175]

Hugh George Cholmondeley, 5th Baron Delamere dead at 82. Wiki claims he's 90. He was picked in a few pools about a decade ago.

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

42 minutes ago, Summer in Transylvania said:

Hugh George Cholmondeley, 5th Baron Delamere dead at 82. Wiki claims he's 90. He was picked in a few pools about a decade ago.

Wiki is correct. Did a search for Hugh Cholmondeley in the birth index from 1934 to 1944 and this was the only hit:

Births Mar 1934   (>99%)

---

Cholmondeley Hugh G Scott Kensington 1a145  

Edit: Kenyan obit with the correct age here

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

On 14/09/2024 at 09:36, YoungWillz said:

Updating the list of Dukes, Marquesses and Earls who have reached or will reach 80 or over by or in 2025 (again, Wiki is my friend, any errors are theirs):

 

Ireland:

 

*snip*

George Dawson-Damer, 7th Earl of Portarlington (b. 1938) - No individual Wiki Page

*snip*

 

Times death notice for George Dawson-Damer, 7th Earl of Portarlington (wiki mention), aged 86:
 

Spoiler

PORTARLINGTON George Lionel Seymour Dawson-Damer, the Earl of Portarlington, much-loved husband, father and grandfather, passed away peacefully at home on 6th October 2024, aged 86. He will be greatly missed. Private funeral.

 

[gcreptile 10,967]

Lord Monson has 4 months to live with terminal cancer:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13954343/Lord-Monson-terminal-cancer.html

 

Well, once you read past the headline, you realize that he could also live for 4 more years, as it's terminal prostate cancer. So a bit like Frank Field maybe, only younger.

[The Old Crem 3,583]

3 hours ago, gcreptile said:

Lord Monson has 4 months to live with terminal cancer:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13954343/Lord-Monson-terminal-cancer.html

 

Well, once you read past the headline, you realize that he could also live for 4 more years, as it's terminal prostate cancer. So a bit like Frank Field maybe, only younger.

He has other conditions like Cardiomyopathy and Diabetes and previous history of poor health pre cancer which prehaps means he won’t last as long as Frank Field did and could be one for 2025/2026. 

[YoungWillz 21,037]

Death notice for Gillian Joynson-Hicks (nee Schluter), Viscountess Brentford, aged 81: https://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/marketplace/advert/brentford-notices_59513

 

Her husband Crispin Joynson-Hicks, 4th Viscount Brentford (b. 1933) survives her.

[Sean 6,315]

On 13/10/2024 at 09:44, gcreptile said:

Lord Monson has 4 months to live with terminal cancer:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13954343/Lord-Monson-terminal-cancer.html

 

Well, once you read past the headline, you realize that he could also live for 4 more years, as it's terminal prostate cancer. So a bit like Frank Field maybe, only younger.

I knew his son Rupert.He was a lovely guy.Never met his father but my heart breaks for the poor guy.

[YoungWillz 21,037]

On 14/09/2024 at 09:36, YoungWillz said:

Updating the list of Dukes, Marquesses and Earls who have reached or will reach 80 or over by or in 2025 (again, Wiki is my friend, any errors are theirs):

 

Earls:

 

Scotland:

 

Margaret of Mar, 31st Countess of Mar (b. 1940)

Ian Maitland, 18th Earl of Lauderdale (b. 1937)

Andrew Bruce, 11th Earl of Elgin and 15th Earl of Kincardine (b. 1924)

Patrick Carnegy, 15th Earl of Northesk (b. 1940)

Filippo Rospigliosi, 11th Prince Rospigliosi and 12th Earl of Newburgh (b. 1942) - No Individual Wiki Page

Patrick Hope-Johnstone, 11th Earl of Annandale and Hartfell (b. 1941)

Peter St John, 9th Earl of Orkney (b. 1938)

Ian Ogilvie-Grant, 13th Earl of Seafield (b. 1939)

Patrick Boyle, 10th Earl of Glasgow (b. 1939)

Victoria, Countess of Elgin death notice: https://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/marketplace/advert/elgin-notices_59781

 

Outlived by the Earl of Elgin, Andrew Bruce.

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

23 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

Victoria, Countess of Elgin death notice: https://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/marketplace/advert/elgin-notices_59781

 

Outlived by the Earl of Elgin, Andrew Bruce.

Countess of Elgin was born in 1943 so 19 years younger than her husband.

 

He has earned his place on The Immortals list by now.

[YoungWillz 21,037]

8 minutes ago, Ulitzer95 said:

Countess of Elgin was born in 1943 so 19 years younger than her husband.

 

He has earned his place on The Immortals list by now.

Married her when she was 16? Is that right?!!!

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

9 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

Married her when she was 16? Is that right?!!!

That’s what I questioned at first. Her DOB is missing on The Peerage, from Debretts, Wiki and an age is missing from her death notice, but it’s the only match on FreeBMD when I searched between 1920 and 1950.

[prussianblue 1,027]

1 hour ago, Ulitzer95 said:

That’s what I questioned at first. Her DOB is missing on The Peerage, from Debretts, Wiki and an age is missing from her death notice, but it’s the only match on FreeBMD when I searched between 1920 and 1950.

 

She was on the cover of Country Life just prior to her marriage. Unfortunately the caption doesn't include her age, but does she look 16? In the '50s everyone looked older.

[Toast 16,137]

3 hours ago, Ulitzer95 said:

That’s what I questioned at first. Her DOB is missing on The Peerage, from Debretts, Wiki and an age is missing from her death notice, but it’s the only match on FreeBMD when I searched between 1920 and 1950.

 

Was she born in Scotland though?  If so, it won't be on FreeBMD or GRO as they only cover England and Wales.  

Anybody got Scotland's People? Not sure what range of BMDs they have.

[msc 18,439]

12 minutes ago, Toast said:

 

Was she born in Scotland though?  If so, it won't be on FreeBMD or GRO as they only cover England and Wales.  

Anybody got Scotland's People? Not sure what range of BMDs they have.

Surname

USHER

Forename

VICTORIA MARY

Mother's Maiden Name

Gender

F

Year

1939

 

Right area of birth for her parents.

[Toast 16,137]

If you can extrapolate her mother's maiden  name from the parents' marriage and add it to the search, that might confirm.  Looks like this is her though.

GRO doesn't give mmn for births in the last 100 years, but if you know it and enter it in the search, it shows up in the result. Maybe SP works the same way?

[msc 18,439]

1 hour ago, Toast said:

If you can extrapolate her mother's maiden  name from the parents' marriage and add it to the search, that might confirm.  Looks like this is her though.

GRO doesn't give mmn for births in the last 100 years, but if you know it and enter it in the search, it shows up in the result. Maybe SP works the same way?

Added the mother's maiden name now I'm home. It's her.

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

I had a blonde moment and searched in FreeBMD instead of Scotland’s People. Whoops. Yes, 1939 seems to be correct. 

[YoungWillz 21,037]

John Skeffington, 14th Viscount Massereene and 7th Viscount Ferrard, death notice: https://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/marketplace/advert/massereene-and-ferrard-notices_59728

 

Heir apparent is son Charles (b. 1973).

[Ulitzer95 12,586]

12 hours ago, YoungWillz said:

John Skeffington, 14th Viscount Massereene and 7th Viscount Ferrard, death notice: https://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/marketplace/advert/massereene-and-ferrard-notices_59728

 

Heir apparent is son Charles (b. 1973).

President of the Conservative Monday Club from 1981 to 1991, thus gets a pre-written full Telegraph obit.

His death means that Jonathan Guinness, 3rd Baron Moyne (wiki), who will be 95 in March, is probably the only living peer who was a member of the club whilst a member of the Lords in its heyday (i.e. before the Club was disaffiliated from the Conservative Party in 2001).

Whilst I'm here, I see the Conservative Monday Club was quietly abolished in its entirety in July 2024.