dead PW Botha

[Guest Proudly South African]

but you have been a bunch of lucky bastards not to have been hanged on the spot in 1990-1994. Instead of looking back nostalgically to the good old days you should be working hard to clean the mess your fathers left.

 

Lucky?? I think I would have much rather have been hung than have to live in fear for my life daily. Fear of being caught in the middle of one of the numerous cash-in-transit robberies, fear of being hijacked raped and murdered, fear of waking up to find that someone has broken in to my home while I was asleep and managed to bypass the security system.

 

Fear for my children - will they make it home safely or will they too become a statistic??

 

You don't have to believe us, come and visit our beautiful country (yes, it is very beautiful). Just do us that live here all a favour when you do visit. (1) Please do not hire the fanciest car available - you will get hijacked. Rather, buy an old scrapheap off the side of the road. (2) Please do not drive around with your valuables openly displayed in the car - you will become a "smash and grab" statistic. (3) Please DO disobey road rules if you insist on being out and about late at night. Do NOT stop at red robots and stop signs, rather yield and then keep going. (4) Please do not accept advice from "charitable" South Africans irrespective of colour - ESPECIALLY in the big Cities. Rather invest in GPRS - much safer.

 

For those of you wondering, I was born in SA and have never set foot outside of its borders. I have hope for my Country but, slowly that hope is dwindling because of the oppressive attitude that the blacks have towards the rest of South Africans who aren't black. I also have never, EVER agreed with political parties such as the AWB, Freedom Front, etc. You cannot right a wrong with another wrong.

 

What was supposed to be teething problems for our Country has turned in to a vicious abcess which, if not treated will erupt in to something too awful to think about.

 

PW Botha was and always will be a part of our history along with all the other white and black politicians. Some of them did good things but most of them were just to darn dumb to realise that what they were doing was wrong. Let us rebuild our Country with "EQUAL RIGHTS" (which is after all part of our constitution) and the first place to start is to make the government realise that the only way to curb the crime in this country is to impose harsher sentences, including the death sentence for hardened criminals. Crime and ignorance will be the downfall of South Africa nothing more and nothing less!!

[Tomb raider 9]

but you have been a bunch of lucky bastards not to have been hanged on the spot in 1990-1994. Instead of looking back nostalgically to the good old days you should be working hard to clean the mess your fathers left.

 

Lucky?? I think I would have much rather have been hung than have to live in fear for my life daily. Fear of being caught in the middle of one of the numerous cash-in-transit robberies, fear of being hijacked raped and murdered, fear of waking up to find that someone has broken in to my home while I was asleep and managed to bypass the security system.

 

Fear for my children - will they make it home safely or will they too become a statistic??

 

You don't have to believe us, come and visit our beautiful country (yes, it is very beautiful).

 

You don't make it sound like a joyful experience, so I think I'll decline. Thank you.

 

Just do us that live here all a favour when you do visit. (1) Please do not hire the fanciest car available - you will get hijacked. Rather, buy an old scrapheap off the side of the road. (2) Please do not drive around with your valuables openly displayed in the car - you will become a "smash and grab" statistic. (3) Please DO disobey road rules if you insist on being out and about late at night. Do NOT stop at red robots and stop signs, rather yield and then keep going. (4) Please do not accept advice from "charitable" South Africans irrespective of colour - ESPECIALLY in the big Cities. Rather invest in GPRS - much safer.

 

Unfortunately, it seems that you're not exaggerating. Yesterday's newspaper summed up: 330.000 robberies last year, between 18 and 32 thousand murders, 1 in 5 SA-males had been involved in a rape. I'm shocked, but once again: I firmly object to the suggestion that apartheid should not have been abolished.

 

For those of you wondering, I was born in SA and have never set foot outside of its borders. I have hope for my Country but, slowly that hope is dwindling because of the oppressive attitude that the blacks have towards the rest of South Africans who aren't black. I also have never, EVER agreed with political parties such as the AWB, Freedom Front, etc. You cannot right a wrong with another wrong.

 

I agree. (I'm sure it's a comfort for you that a pigheaded dutchman who never set foot on South African soil agrees!) But let's be frank: this is not entirely a racial thing. Many of your country's leaders are stupid dimwits who care about nothing but their own benefit, which is not at all an exclusively South African problem.

 

What was supposed to be teething problems for our Country has turned in to a vicious abcess which, if not treated will erupt in to something too awful to think about.

 

PW Botha was and always will be a part of our history along with all the other white and black politicians. Some of them did good things but most of them were just to darn dumb to realise that what they were doing was wrong. Let us rebuild our Country with "EQUAL RIGHTS" (which is after all part of our constitution) and the first place to start is to make the government realise that the only way to curb the crime in this country is to impose harsher sentences, including the death sentence for hardened criminals. Crime and ignorance will be the downfall of South Africa nothing more and nothing less!!

 

Now, what started as a remarkably sensible outline ended up in the rather predictable and well-known appeal for harsher sentences and the death penalty. As someone else on this forum rightfully stated: the death penalty has never made a country less criminal. Economic prosperity does, however. You should get rid of the corruption, invest in education, in an authoritative police force, in improving living conditions for the poor. Those factors have always been crucial in dropping down crime rates. If you don't believe me, go to the United States, they execute between 50 and 100 people a year (some of them minors or mental patients) and it never worked to make the country a safe, civilized and law-abiding nation.

[Guest Guest_Albert_*]

PW Botha was the greatest and most decent leader that Afica has ever seen. As a young man serving in the early eighties South African defence force I very proud to have served under him. When PW Botha reingned South Africa was decent Christian country with peace and prosperity even the Kaffirs lived well and their needs were taken care of. How many blacks that I have spoken to have said to me that under Apartheid things were better for them.

I make no pretence of it I dont want to live near blacks I cant stand them, they stink, are stupid, ugly and behave like animals they break and steal everything that their black eyeballs see.

Does this mean that I wish them ill or want to kill them, no they too have right to live on God's earth but they must be kept in check or they will destroy you.

If white South Africans had done what Americans and Austrailians have done to their indigineous populations

we would have had no problems.

It is because white South Africans were to decent to kill all blacks that they are being murdered, raped and robbed by these black animals.

To the homosexuals, illuminati money grabbers of London, left wing journolists, scum bag thief ANC officials,

Satanists that control the media and filthy islamic sh*t that is growing in England. If you had one percent of the intelligence, wisdom, itegrityand courage of PW Botha you would understand what has happened in South Africa.

When PW stepped down South Africa was finished. Today South Africa is reaping a terrible harvest of murders, destruction that will end in famine and collapse just like the rest of Africa.

Yes come for the world cup 2010 see what will happen to you.

[Tomb raider 9]

PW Botha was the greatest and most decent leader that Afica has ever seen. As a young man serving in the early eighties South African defence force I very proud to have served under him. When PW Botha reingned South Africa was decent Christian country with peace and prosperity even the Kaffirs lived well and their needs were taken care of. How many blacks that I have spoken to have said to me that under Apartheid things were better for them.

I make no pretence of it I dont want to live near blacks I cant stand them, they stink, are stupid, ugly and behave like animals they break and steal everything that their black eyeballs see.

Does this mean that I wish them ill or want to kill them, no they too have right to live on God's earth but they must be kept in check or they will destroy you.

If white South Africans had done what Americans and Austrailians have done to their indigineous populations

we would have had no problems.

It is because white South Africans were to decent to kill all blacks that they are being murdered, raped and robbed by these black animals.

To the homosexuals, illuminati money grabbers of London, left wing journolists, scum bag thief ANC officials,

Satanists that control the media and filthy islamic sh*t that is growing in England. If you had one percent of the intelligence, wisdom, itegrityand courage of PW Botha you would understand what has happened in South Africa.

When PW stepped down South Africa was finished. Today South Africa is reaping a terrible harvest of murders, destruction that will end in famine and collapse just like the rest of Africa.

Yes come for the world cup 2010 see what will happen to you.

 

Now, my dear sir, I sense some inarticulate racist sentiments here!

[Drive-by Flatterer 1]

PW Botha was the greatest and most decent leader that Afica has ever seen. As a young man serving in the early eighties South African defence force I very proud to have served under him. When PW Botha reingned South Africa was decent Christian country with peace and prosperity even the Kaffirs lived well and their needs were taken care of. How many blacks that I have spoken to have said to me that under Apartheid things were better for them.

I make no pretence of it I dont want to live near blacks I cant stand them, they stink, are stupid, ugly and behave like animals they break and steal everything that their black eyeballs see.

Does this mean that I wish them ill or want to kill them, no they too have right to live on God's earth but they must be kept in check or they will destroy you.

If white South Africans had done what Americans and Austrailians have done to their indigineous populations

we would have had no problems.

It is because white South Africans were to decent to kill all blacks that they are being murdered, raped and robbed by these black animals.

To the homosexuals, illuminati money grabbers of London, left wing journolists, scum bag thief ANC officials,

Satanists that control the media and filthy islamic sh*t that is growing in England. If you had one percent of the intelligence, wisdom, itegrityand courage of PW Botha you would understand what has happened in South Africa.

When PW stepped down South Africa was finished. Today South Africa is reaping a terrible harvest of murders, destruction that will end in famine and collapse just like the rest of Africa.

Yes come for the world cup 2010 see what will happen to you.

 

I think it's great that a very busy man like Sepp Blatter can take the time to post on here to promote good will for the 2010 World Cup

[Magere Hein 1,400]

PW Botha was the greatest and most decent leader that Afica has ever seen. As a young man serving in the early eighties South African defence force I very proud to have served under him.

 

[Racist rant snipped]

It's nice to see a racist posting from England showing his intelligence, or rather his lack thereof.

 

regards,

Hein

[Anubis the Jackal 77]

I agree. (I'm sure it's a comfort for you that a pigheaded dutchman who never set foot on South African soil agrees!) .

 

 

 

I thought all the pigheaded dutchmen were sent to South Africa long ago, (only for them to pitch up in London in the late '90's)

[Guest Proudly South African]

I object strongly to the use of the word "kaffir". Although in years gone by not mean't as a derogatory word, us whites have made it such. You sir, are a racist and it is people like you that should leave the Country for greener pastures because it is attitudes like yours that will HELP in destroying our Country!!!

 

Oh, and another thing, just where in SA do you live??? Not all blacks stink, not all blacks steal and not all blacks are stupid. I, quite frankly, prefer my black neighbour to my lowlife white "Jerry Springer Special" neighbour. (And I live in a decent , upmarket area).

 

I also object to your reference to National Military Service. What did PW Botha do for the Special Forces Service men who had to kill and maim in the name of "white freedom"?? What phsycological treatment was offered to them when they returned?? I'll tell you, NONE!!!

 

My whole argument has been that PW Botha was not all bad. He wasn't a dictator but he sure as hell wasn't a Saint either!! He made some serious mistakes during his "reign" but then so did a lot of presidents from a lot of Countries.

 

The other part of my argument has been that what happened in the past (apartheid) is being repeated today - just under a different (yet to be named) system. I agree with education, housing, etc. But I also agree with equal oppurtunity and if this Country is going to grow, we need to wait until the current highschool students (black) graduate from University, gain life experience and THEN step in to senior positions they are able to fulfill.

 

With regards to the death penalty, a rapist and murderer will think twice before committing the crime if he knows what will happen if he is caught. Currently, our prisons are "holiday camps". DSTV (cable), a television in every cell, free clothing, free BALANCED meals three times a day, the oppurtunity to receive an education, life skills (painter, welder, farmer, etc).

So, knowing this, criminals don't mind being locked up. Jail is sometimes better than home.

 

We were named the Rainbow Nation and if we are to find the proverbial pot of gold at the end of our rainbow, we need to bury the past, concentrate on the present and strive for a better future for ALL South Africans. TOGETHER!!!!

[Magere Hein 1,400]

Oh, and another thing, just where in SA do you live???

He doesn't. Our racist posted from England.

 

regards,

Hein

[Octopus of Odstock 2,197]

By the way, I for one, and I concede I may be the only one, like the South African accent. I much prefer their sonorous tones to the phlegm coated, guttural whinings of say the Scousers or the disinterested, lethargic vowels of our friends in the West Midlands.

 

You're not the only one.

I prefer it far far more than an American or Australian accent. In fact, it's one of my favourite accents, and certainly near the top of those non-British accents.

 

I'm not going to get into this debate too much, although I am well qualified to.

 

I have a cousin who lives in Johannesburg, a friend/work colleague from Cape Town & I know quite a few South Africans through my motorsport work, and I was at the GPM meeting at Kyalami last year.

 

However, I did not visit South Africa during Botha's time, and my cousin did not live there at that time either. My work colleague was just 6 when Botha stepped down, so their whole experience is not as complete as others here.

 

I've seen for myself, and heard myself that South Africa has major problems now, but like all problems in a country, it's not always down to just one thing. However, when I went there, and going by all those South Africans I've met, their hospitality is second to none and I wish them well in resolving the problems their country faces.

 

Whether that will be helped or hindered by the death of Botha, I do not know, but I personally was not sorry to see him go.

[Youth in Asia 1,087]

If white South Africans had done what Americans and Austrailians have done to their indigineous populations

we would have had no problems.

 

The white South Africans came about 200 years too late to replicate what the Americans and Australians did in their countries.

[Anubis the Jackal 77]

My point being proved, I think.

 

Oh, and another thing, just where in SA do you live???

He doesn't. Our racist posted from England.

 

regards,

Hein

[Tomb raider 9]

I agree. (I'm sure it's a comfort for you that a pigheaded dutchman who never set foot on South African soil agrees!) .

 

 

 

I thought all the pigheaded dutchmen were sent to South Africa long ago, (only for them to pitch up in London in the late '90's)

 

Many of them were, but that was so long ago that several new generations of pigheaded dutchmen have evolved in the meantime.

 

I'm the living proof of that.

[Anubis the Jackal 77]

I think I fit nearly all of that description.

To the homosexuals, illuminati money grabbers of London, left wing journolists, scum bag thief ANC officials,

Satanists that control the media and filthy islamic sh*t that is growing in England.

 

You, Sir are an imbecile.

[Godot 149]

I make no pretence of it I dont want to live near blacks I cant stand them, they stink, are stupid, ugly and behave like animals they break and steal everything that their black eyeballs see.

 

I think Albert is a little in error on this point. Albert of all people, should be familiar with the phrase: "Wait until you can see the whites of their eyes," used to calm the phalanxes of red-coated troops (the goodies) with their Martini-Henri Rifles cocked and loaded as hoards of asaghi-wielding natives (baddies and always black, wearing grass skirts with bones in their noses and gibbering in some foreign tongue) charge at "our boys". What joy when the volleys drop them (the baddies) in their hundreds. This seems fair enough when the consequence of failure, as we all know, was a hot soak in the stewpot over a large camp fire. No, when it comes to eyeballs, they're white and round the world over. Even Prince Philip knows that slitty eyes are not about the eyeballs.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

Even Prince Philip knows that slitty eyes are not about the eyeballs

 

What, he's got piles has he?

[Grim_Rita 4]

I'm going to South Africa in November, so I'll report back on the political situation and Mr Botha's health later in the year. Unless he dies beforehand of course, in which case I'll limit myself to politics and the state of South African beer.

 

The ole crocodile must of gotten wind of your trip and decided to peg it on the last day of October before you arrived!

[CarolAnn 926]

With regards to the death penalty, a rapist and murderer will think twice before committing the crime if he knows what will happen if he is caught.

 

You obviously don't live in Dallas, Los Angeles, New York, Washington DC, Miami, Atlanta........

[Guest Guest]

With regards to the death penalty, a rapist and murderer will think twice before committing the crime if he knows what will happen if he is caught.

 

You obviously don't live in Dallas, Los Angeles, New York, Washington DC, Miami, Atlanta........

 

Just to bring a brief note of sanity to this debate, isn't it pleasing to think that Madiba has outlasted all the apartheid leaders? Malan, Strijdom, Verwoerd, Vorster and now PWB. In poker terms, I think that's called a royal flush.

[Tempus Fugit 214]

Botha, dead!!

 

Oh say it aint so!

 

Why are the good ones taken so young.

[maryportfuncity 10,646]

Tempus, dunno if you heard Last Word today but Botha's was a real deja vu jobbie for them as might remember. Pik Botha put in a pithy defence, neatly sidestepping anything suggest the great man might have been involved in offing political opponents or otherwise arranging death and other illegal goings on before Janet Suzeman put in a surprisingly upbeat assessment of the great days they had on opposing sides.

 

Incidentally, Pik Botha's brain is clearly in fine form and he sounded really healthy, nowt doing in DL terms there for ages.

[One shot Paddy 1,206]

Unless he gets on a PanAm flight (yes I know they don't exist anymore). Wasant he ment to be on a certan flight 103!!!

[themaninblack 2,112]

All together now...

 

No he's never met a nice South African

And that's not bloody surprising man

'Cause we're a bunch of ignorant loudmouths

With no sense of humour - ha ha....

 

[The Four Horsemen 26]

Good job too, makes my reporting a little easier. We are due to be staying in Wilderness (where he lived in retirement), wonder if they'll have any memorials or the like?

[Magere Hein 1,400]

Good job too, makes my reporting a little easier. We are due to be staying in Wilderness (where he lived in retirement), wonder if they'll have any memorials or the like?

Do lots of Afrikaners live in Wilderness? If so, they'll want to commemorate die Oubaas.

 

regards,

Hein