TQR 14,386 Posted June 13 His one throwaway comment is the gift that keeps on giving 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toast 16,131 Posted June 13 35 minutes ago, En Passant said: To be honest, Since I'm interested in policies rather than rhetoric I'd happily vote for Lib Dems where I am or in fact it appears according to that quiz - binface. However locally is a swing seat between Labour / Tories so my hands are tied if I want shot of the Tories. I'm not as hopeful as many here that labour will deliver nirvana or even what we want in basic terms (see post above about paying for it), but under first past the post I can't vote any other way. Same here. If I hadn't been gerrymandered I would be voting Lib Dem, no hesitation. I did last time but the Tory still got in. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BuffaloPhil 926 Posted June 13 My constituency has always been Tory but it looks like the Lib Dems have the best shot at getting them out - current YouGov projection is Con 35.7%, Lib Dem 34.3%, Lab 14.1%, Reform 11.4%, Green 3.7% - so I will be voting Lib Dem. I think I probably would have leant that way anyway unless it was a Lab/Con shootout or the Greens had any kind of chance. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TQR 14,386 Posted June 13 YouGov poll has Reform 1 point ahead of the Conservative party - 19% plays 18%. YouGov polls have been known to throw up some weird things in the past and I wouldn't read too much into this, but that's got to sting the Tories. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DCI Frank Burnside 3,887 Posted June 13 Ooooooffffff 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TQR 14,386 Posted June 13 Quote "While a miracle of late persuasion cannot be ruled out, at present the most relevant question for Conservative MPs isn’t “can we win?” but rather “can any of us survive?” Inject this into my veins. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bibliogryphon 9,571 Posted June 13 9 hours ago, The Old Crem said: At the last election every seat in Northamptonshire was blue. Labour captured Wellingborough at a by-election. Kettering turned Blue in 2005. If Kettering and Wellingborough are vulnerable then the rest could be. Here's hoping 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Old Crem 3,582 Posted June 13 54 minutes ago, TQR said: YouGov poll has Reform 1 point ahead of the Conservative party - 19% plays 18%. YouGov polls have been known to throw up some weird things in the past and I wouldn't read too much into this, but that's got to sting the Tories. Putting it in to the electoral Calculus gives Labour 464 Tory 71 Lib Dem 69 SNP 14 Reform 5 (Ashfield, Boston and Skegness, Clacton, Torridge and Tavistock, Wellingborough and Rushden) Plaid 4 Green 2 Other 3 (Birmingham Ladywood, Islington North and Rochdale) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TQR 14,386 Posted June 13 Against better judgement, I have been watching the ITV debate. Cooper, again, is comfortably the best at this. Mordaunt, again, is a handful of desperate “…but Labour”s away from an aneurysm. Her, and Farage this time, are getting laughed out of the room. I’m enjoying Lib Dem, Green, SNP and Plaid Cymru salvos going Labour’s way. Makes me yearn more for an official opposition like the Lib Dems; they’ll be able to hold a Labour government to account far, far more effectively, and without resorting to lies and dogwhistle rhetoric. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Brad252 807 Posted June 13 On 12/06/2024 at 22:47, Thatcher said: Question being if that does happen, people don’t trust the Tories, let down by Labour, where do they turn? Grassroots campaigning for much-needed reforms of the whole political shabang. I know quite a few campaigns expected to be ramping up after this election with the aim of influencing the following election. Voting reform will be top, but there will probably also be campaigns around media reform, party donors, House of Lords abolition, etc. More of the population need to realise that democracy is not about one vote every 4-5 years, if they're not happy with the state of play, they need to get off their backsides and do something about it another way. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoverAndOut 4,746 Posted June 13 14 minutes ago, Brad252 said: Grassroots campaigning for much-needed reforms of the whole political shabang. I know quite a few campaigns expected to be ramping up after this election with the aim of influencing the following election. Voting reform will be top, but there will probably also be campaigns around media reform, party donors, House of Lords abolition, etc. More of the population need to realise that democracy is not about one vote every 4-5 years, if they're not happy with the state of play, they need to get off their backsides and do something about it another way. The problem is they don't vote for it when it's offered. The reason Labour are being cautious not radical is because people blamed them for crashing the economy in 2010 and elected a Tory government who pursued austerity, which ws apparently so terrible they gave them a majority 5 years later. Corbyn offered a radical set of policies and was rejected twice. People have rejected AV, voted for Brexit, which paralysed our political system and has crippled us financially, and gave Boris a massive majority to spaff up the wall quite aside from Covid and Ukraine. They demand lower taxes, increased public spending, politicians who tell the truth (but won't vote for them if they say anything daring or controversial), more housing while rejecting planning applications left, right and centre, more hospital appointments but less immigration to fill the skills gaps, and so on and so forth. Politicians will not be straight with you or give bold ideas when the public are not grown up enough to have a rational and measured discussion about the topics. I would love Keir Starmer to come out in front of a camera and explain "OK, here's the thing. This is the situation the Tories have left us in. Here is the black hole we're facing. While I am aiming to increase productivity and growth, this will take time, so in the meantime I have a choice between raising taxes to pay for services (but the tax burden is already higher than it has been for 70 years) or cutting spending in some areas to balance the books. Assuming you want me to protect your children's schools and the NHS, that means I'll need to cut money off policing and local government, who are already stretched too thin. So do you want higher taxes or spending cuts? Because, for now, its one or the other." Of course, if he comes out and says that, all those people who wanted him to be honest will vote for someone else - potentially the pariah Tories who promise the Land of Milk and Honey instead. Labour's 200 seat majority vanishes and we end up with a Hung Parliament, all because Starmer tried to be straight with the voters, who said that's what they wanted. It's a mess of our own making. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DCI Frank Burnside 3,887 Posted June 14 13 hours ago, TQR said: YouGov poll has Reform 1 point ahead of the Conservative party - 19% plays 18%. YouGov polls have been known to throw up some weird things in the past and I wouldn't read too much into this, but that's got to sting the Tories. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DCI Frank Burnside 3,887 Posted June 14 And so it begins Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Old Crem 3,582 Posted June 14 38 minutes ago, DCI Frank Burnside said: Parties have through in the last suddenly proposed new policies post manifesto launch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Master Obit 828 Posted June 14 People got pissed at TOC for spamming twitter links. I admit the quality of these is higher, but do we really need quite so many? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungWillz 21,033 Posted June 14 Laura Trott is a laugh a minute. Apparently, Starmer and Labour are Machiavellian schemers who aren't telling you what they would do, particularly on tax. It's not what is in their manifesto, it's what is not there. Reform haven't promised to invade France. The Tories haven't promised to open a Vietnamese restaurant on every street in the UK. The Greens haven't promised to deface Constable's The Haywain. The SNP haven't promised to make the National Anthem Sheena Easton's 9 To 5 (Morning Train). The LibDems haven't promised to deport every Tory voter to the Phillippines. Who knows what all these parties' secret plans are? Any of the above might just happen. Trott along. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bibliogryphon 9,571 Posted June 14 11 minutes ago, YoungWillz said: Who knows what all these parties' secret plans are? Any of the above might just happen John o' Farrell did make an interesting point yesterday The reforming Labour Parliament under Harold Wilson (66-70) which introduced significant social reforms such as removing the abortion ban, the introduction of no-fault divorces and the decriminalisation of male homosexuality - none of those items were included in the Labour manifesto Though they did go on to lose power in 1970 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TQR 14,386 Posted June 14 18 minutes ago, YoungWillz said: Laura Trott is a laugh a minute. Apparently, Starmer and Labour are Machiavellian schemers who aren't telling you what they would do, particularly on tax. It's not what is in their manifesto, it's what is not there. Reform haven't promised to invade France. The Tories haven't promised to open a Vietnamese restaurant on every street in the UK. The Greens haven't promised to deface Constable's The Haywain. The SNP haven't promised to make the National Anthem Sheena Easton's 9 To 5 (Morning Train). The LibDems haven't promised to deport every Tory voter to the Phillippines. Who knows what all these parties' secret plans are? Any of the above might just happen. Trott along. Luckily enough, Penny Meltdown expertly exposed all their secret plans in the ITV debate. "Hire taxis, hire taxis, hire taxis, hire taxis, hire taxis, hire taxis" 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
