The Ukraine Crisis

[arghton 6,752]

Russia's new supersoldier, the Texas Man:

Name is Russell Bentley, 61 or 62. 

[the_engineer 1,415]

4 hours ago, Grim Up North said:

 

Agree - if we were going to do this we may as well go the whole hog and just join Ukraine in combat.

 

It does though raise an interesting question - what would Putin/Russia have to do for NATO to be dragged into the combat.

 

Would it have to be invasion of a NATO country?

What about a public execution of Zelensky?

 

Video of war atrocities against Ukrainian civilians is not enough - at the moment the West looks weak and that 40 mile convoy of armed vehicles, tanks etc is going to massacre tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians in the next few days - okay or not okay? Words won't save them and neither will the Russian economy being 30% weaker in 5 years. Meanwhile we stand by and talk about how terrible it all is.

 

I genuinely think a public brutal execution of zelenskyy, could bring NATO into the war. 

[The Old Crem 3,606]

4 hours ago, Bibliogryphon said:

 

It may not be a full scale invasion such as we have witnessed in Ukraine but any military incursion into a NATO state. The Baltic states are a particular issue as they are sandwiched between bits of Russia

Even air raids would trigger it. And the Baltic state capitals are easily in the range of Russian conventional missiles.
 

President Lukashenko of Belarus appeared on state Tv with a map which seems to show Russian wants to invade the separatist part of Moldova. Romania would find it hard to not get involved if the whole of the Moldova then somehow became a war zone and Romania is in NATO. I can’t see that theatre causing WW3 but it’s not impossible. 

[MortalCaso 1,629]

13 minutes ago, The Old Crem said:

Even air raids would trigger it. And the Baltic state capitals are easily in the range of Russian conventional missiles.
 

President Lukashenko of Belarus appeared on state Tv with a map which seems to show Russian wants to invade the separatist part of Moldova. Romania would find it hard to not get involved if the whole of the Moldova then somehow became a war zone and Romania is in NATO. I can’t see that theatre causing WW3 but it’s not impossible. 

It wouldn't be an invasion. They already control that area of Moldova and have for quite some time. It's a mere formality. 

 

Everyone keeps saying WW3. It isn't happening. A World War takes allies. Russia has none. China isn't going to risk World War for a country they don't even like much. China wants to, and is becoming, the new U.S style world-power. Mainly through economics. They would waste a lot of time and effort to fight now. If Russia escalates this farther they (Putin) will be alone.

[maryportfuncity 10,647]

2 hours ago, MortalCaso said:

It wouldn't be an invasion. They already control that area of Moldova and have for quite some time. It's a mere formality. 

 

Everyone keeps saying WW3. It isn't happening. A World War takes allies. Russia has none. China isn't going to risk World War for a country they don't even like much. China wants to, and is becoming, the new U.S style world-power. Mainly through economics. They would waste a lot of time and effort to fight now. If Russia escalates this farther they (Putin) will be alone.

 

Aye, and there's the problem of holding the conquered territory if the bulk of those stationed there are the kind of raw recruits who've been melting in the face of Ukrainian resistance. Invading and holding means establishing bases, from which you have to patrol if you want to maintain control - Afghanistan is a lesson learned in that respect. The bulk of the Ukrainian population don't want the Russians there. Snipers, booby traps, civil disobience and arms supplied over the western borders. If anyone's selling shares in Russian body bags - I'll invest.

[CastAway 488]

Well, we heard about Ukrainian athletes taking up arms, here's your first death among them significant enough to get a decent amount of coverage. 

[MortalCaso 1,629]

There should be a list made somewhere.

 

Somewhat like the notable COVID-19 list Wikipedia has. Is that something you could add to the new wiki site you guys made @Ulitzer95?

 

So far we have a Chechyna General, Ukrainian military figure, and now an athlete. The list will increase sadly, only getting more notable as we go.

[Ulitzer95 12,654]

7 hours ago, MortalCaso said:

There should be a list made somewhere.

 

Somewhat like the notable COVID-19 list Wikipedia has. Is that something you could add to the new wiki site you guys made @Ulitzer95?

 

So far we have a Chechyna General, Ukrainian military figure, and now an athlete. The list will increase sadly, only getting more notable as we go.

I mean I could but… 

 

Not that I’m being insensitive. I just have no interest in memorialising fatalities of war who are neither notable or personal to me. Sorry.

[arghton 6,752]

https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-2000008651871.html

Finnish parliament member Tom Packalén is, for an unknown reason, in a bomb shelter in Lviv. 

[Toast 16,143]

[Windsor 2,233]

I think the media are being unfair in suggesting that Russia is targeting civilians.

 

In any film I've ever watched the baddies usually have a shit aim. I posit that they are actually aiming for military targets, but their status as 'baddies' makes them incapable of hitting them... 

[CastAway 488]

Kherson seems to have fallen, becoming the first major city to fall. 

 

In other news on the "denazification of Ukraine," turns out Holocaust survivors have opinions as well:

 

There's an English subtitle of the video in the replies, and even for someone who spends quite some time on this forum, it's difficult stuff to watch. 

[maryportfuncity 10,647]

 

Losing the battle for hearts and minds

 

[CastAway 488]

OSCE monitor killed in shelling

[Ulitzer95 12,654]

12 hours ago, arghton said:

https://www.is.fi/politiikka/art-2000008651871.html

Finnish parliament member Tom Packalén is, for an unknown reason, in a bomb shelter in Lviv. 

Adam Holloway, a current British Conservative MP is there as well.

He has a death wish. Went to Libya, Iraq and Afghanistan during all of those conflicts against Foreign Office advice.

[Ulitzer95 12,654]

Volodymyr Struk, Ukrainian former MP and incumbent mayor of the city of Kreminna, found shot dead at 57 (word of warning – don't click on the link if squeamish as there's a photo of his corpse).

I know there's been a junior athlete and one or two minor military ppl, but I consider this to be the first death of note from the war. As such, @Death Impends @Paul Bearer, can you please move this thread to general?

[SovietJohnny 95]

On 02/03/2014 at 17:20, Deathray said:

Seen as the discussion in the End Times thread wasn't welcome I thought I'd start a new thread for following developments in Ukraine.

 

The Navy Chief has defected in support of Crimea.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26410431

How serious does it have to get before I am banned or forced to change my name?.......which actually stems from when I lived in Uzbekistan.

[MortalCaso 1,629]

There has been a few Ukranian deaths noted on Wiki over the last week or so. Seems as though people are reporting the deaths in a more timely manner due to all the attention Ukraine is getting. Or they are dying as a result of conflict.

 

Seems notable either way

[CastAway 488]

3 hours ago, Ulitzer95 said:

Volodymyr Struk, Ukrainian former MP and incumbent mayor of the city of Kreminna, found shot dead at 57 (word of warning – don't click on the link if squeamish as there's a photo of his corpse).

I know there's been a junior athlete and one or two minor military ppl, but I consider this to be the first death of note from the war. As such, @Death Impends @Paul Bearer, can you please move this thread to general?

 

Should note that this guy seems to have been a pro=Russian mayor who tried to negotiate a surrender to the Russians. Per Twitter chatter, seems like nationalists killed him in revenge for what a good amount of Ukrainian commentators are calling treason and there's no small amount of celebration at his death.

[CastAway 488]

Ukrainian born Russian oligarch found hanged in his Surrey mansion:

 

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/ukranian-born-oligarch-mikhail-watford-found-dead/

 

Does this have anything to do with the war? No clue. But an interesting coincidence nonetheless.

[YoungWillz 21,055]

Things I don't understand.

 

Fiercest shelling and fighting in Mariupol and Kharkiv, essentially the most Russian speaking parts of Ukraine after the annexed and separatist areas. Why does Putin murder civilians (including children) mercilessly in the areas he is most likely to have support in the event of a takeover?

 

Also, I tried sleeping on this but I'm just going to get it out. Our UK Government Ministers speak in almost hallowed terms about the rampant inflation and 20% interest rates in Russia, along withthe collapse in banking shares and the value of the rouble, impacting most heavily on the Russian people. Yet when Bawjaws was asked about returning donations to the Tory party perhaps being given back or away to charity, he said at PMQs that this "wasn't about the Russian people". Well of course, it's about the worst off Russian people, not the wealthy ones that line your pockets, Bawjaws.

[msc 18,476]

44 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

Things I don't understand.

 

Fiercest shelling and fighting in Mariupol and Kharkiv, essentially the most Russian speaking parts of Ukraine after the annexed and separatist areas. Why does Putin murder civilians (including children) mercilessly in the areas he is most likely to have support in the event of a takeover?

 

Also, I tried sleeping on this but I'm just going to get it out. Our UK Government Ministers speak in almost hallowed terms about the rampant inflation and 20% interest rates in Russia, along withthe collapse in banking shares and the value of the rouble, impacting most heavily on the Russian people. Yet when Bawjaws was asked about returning donations to the Tory party perhaps being given back or away to charity, he said at PMQs that this "wasn't about the Russian people". Well of course, it's about the worst off Russian people, not the wealthy ones that line your pockets, Bawjaws.

 

Because they didn't do as he wanted. The most Russian speaking bits of Ukraine are fighting tooth and nail to stay Ukrainian, let alone the rest of it. At the risk of being a forum alarmist, I am worried that the targeting of civilians and kids is only going to get much worse. History shows up hard men fuckwit authoritarians are fucking dangerous if their egos are bruised in war. 

 

As for your second point, well, you see, and this may shock you, Boris Johnson is a complete cunt. 

[YoungWillz 21,055]

1 minute ago, msc said:

 

Because they didn't do as he wanted. The most Russian speaking bits of Ukraine are fighting tooth and nail to stay Ukrainian, let alone the rest of it. At the risk of being a forum alarmist, I am worried that the targeting of civilians and kids is only going to get much worse. History shows up hard men fuckwit authoritarians are fucking dangerous if their egos are bruised in war. 

 

As for your second point, well, you see, and this may shock you, Boris Johnson is a complete cunt. 

On your first response - I think Russia has been foolish here. They could have gone round or ignored the Russian heavy areas of Ukraine and concentrated their fire on other areas more supportive of Zelenskyy. 

 

As to your second point: 

 

[Toast 16,143]

2 minutes ago, YoungWillz said:

 I think Russia has been foolish here.

 

 

You mean Putin.   Can we not blame Russia please.

[YoungWillz 21,055]

4 minutes ago, Toast said:

 

You mean Putin.   Can we not blame Russia please.

I completely blame Canada. 

 

South Park affects my judgement on all things.